Thread: ipad build

Well it could be useful if some one would create a proper frontend & port navi apps (garmin,igo,tt, etc..).. still hoping for an instant on frontend.. (like asus's splashtop)

Originally Posted by lugi

Well it could be useful if some one would create a proper frontend & port navi apps (garmin,igo,tt, etc..).. still hoping for an instant on frontend.. (like asus's splashtop)

The ipad takes 15 seconds to boot, hardly instant on. That being said, it supports standby which is almost instant on (1-2 seconds)

Why not just put OSX on it and get it over with? Because it's not uhm uh... it's too powerful for OSX! Yeah.


Gotta yank some chains

Originally Posted by optikalefx

I hate having to always defend apple, but really to those of you who don't use these devices on daily basis you can't really talk. I used a PC (windows xp) for 3 years, and now have been on mac for 4 years. I have both windows 7 and os x computers.

You shouldn't do things that you hate.. especially those things that are in defense of Apple!

Originally Posted by optikalefx

Being a technical person and a programmer, i much much prefer to program on mac os. Now that was hard at first, when i first switched i couldn't program on mac. But after discovering text wrangler, and cyberduck and programs alike, the world was better. The biggest reason i prefer programming on mac than windows is the fonts render so much cleaner on mac than windows.

I won't argue the print quality, but I will say that I too am a software programmer and I prefer Windows for a front-end, with linux/bsd machines to actually do work on. I've used OS/X exclusively for years (forced to for a partic environment) and I've never seen more wrenches thrown in the gears, ever. The shop even targetted OS/X yet the majority of our customers were using Windows. The only time I use OS/X nowadays is to test how code runs on it, for day to day work I find that it is just not up to par - it's very similar to the iPhone in terms of lockdown - and not in any way you can compare to Windows.

My best summary of what they've done to lock it down is:
- requiring an ADC account for access to development APIs and documentation
- lack of proper development tools: it's actually easier to target mono than it is to rewrite your app just for macs, unless you target java. cocoa is only really useful to pure-mac apps as well as those that are ported to iPhones.
- making variations to the core unix/bsd they based OS/X on, in such ways that unix heads will have a learning curve (and find some things missing)
- being 'behind the times' - they copy things and make them look shiny, but in the end they are still copies

Originally Posted by optikalefx

Now the iPad argument is also confused. Yes it is a giant iPod toch, but people love the ipod touch. Moreover, you can't compare this to any other tablet. The multitouch and smoothness is unparalleled by ANY touch screen. I don't care who you are or how many years in the business you have, to this date there is no better touch screen experience than the iPad. with iphone coming close 2nd.

I can compare it to any other tablet, the other tablets don't have multitouch and are full (unlocked) PCs, whereas the iPad is a utility device based on PC components.

Originally Posted by optikalefx

Now you can make the argument that there are more programs for windows for us developers. Well yes, but people who make mac applications really care about UI, and when those apps that you love for windows make it onto the mac, they are usually better than their windows counterparts. *not always, (vlc is the same f.e)

I've already commented on this, but will elaborate a bit more. A lot of the applications you find missing in OS/X, which eventually get equivalents, are copies of an original. This isn't true for them all, but in some way or another they are bringing missing functionality to your OS that is already present in another OS. You also say that the mac versions turn out better, but you are glossing over the concept of natural progression and the software evolution process. The windows versions will can always copy the 'good things' back into their version from the mac version, as well as add some new features, leaving the mac version behind once again. This cycle is doomed to repeat itself so long as Apple is just copying things and making them shiny, and while other people are following suit in "defense" of them.

Macs do have their strengths, and this is largely due to their hardware choices/selection. You can't buy a crap mac (from Apple), so a homebrew PC with sub-par components is out of the question (for testing OS/X vs Windows in a fair setting). A lot of people run windows with sub-par components because it is cheaper than buying a complete system, even one from Apple. With evenly matched hardware, Windows will dominate mac except in print and video quality, which can be compensated for (with even better hardware) to surpass the quality of a mac. This is why I only keep OS/X as a secondary testing environment, I can accomplish much more in Windows than in OS/X. I buy macs for the hardware, but would never in a million years defend their software choices - they are one-sided.

Originally Posted by optikalefx

But seriously, if you use mac as your day to day, you will eventually see that yes, it can do anything your PC can, only better, even if that means someone still needs to make an application for it.

The only way I can accomplish this on my macs is to install Windows on them (if the purpose is a stable and functional desktop that I can depend on and replace quickly). And before you argue that you don't need to replace the OS on a mac as often as on a PC, I only replace the OS when I decide to (ie: not when it or something I installed dictates I should) except in the case of a hardware failure. My macs currently run Windows 7 and can dual boot back into OS/X when I need to test some code. I won't switch from what I have known and trusted for almost 20 years just because people 'say' it's better - I've tried it (and given it a fair run, several years long) and found a lot of things were either missing or just implemented in a "this is our way and you have to accept that and say you like it" fashion.

If Apple made cars this would likely be a lot more clearer to most non-technical folks, and even to some who think they are technical. The gloss is laid on thick, and it's hard not to stare at the shiny bits - just don't let that distract you from what's really missing or the hoops you are jumping through to accomplish things that didn't seem so hard before.

Originally Posted by optikalefx

not to mention iPad will have multitasking in a few months.

Bets on how long before peoples iPads start getting warm/slow from too much crap running in the background? My take on this is that it is just to get people with "slower" devices to upgrade to a new shiny device, so when their friends say they can do X with their iPad they can say "yeah me too" rather than just "ooh cool, my old iPhone is too slow for that".

I believe that a good product will sell itself, and will also defend itself. Any argument in defense of Apple, their software, and their devices, is just plain old-fashioned fanaticism.

Lets not throw any STONES at this great idea! Right?

Roflol

Why does everyone keep saying it can't multitask? The 4.0 software was announced on Thursday, and (guess what?) the iPad gets multitasking!

Why not sooner? Apple isolates their product development teams so that stuff can't leak out. The iPad guys had no interaction with the 4.0 guys (or vice versa), so it'll be here in a few months.

You can and have been able to hook up external HDDs wireless to the iPad / iPhone / iPod touch.

The battery is even in this discussion? If you're mounting it in your vehicle and doing audio out over the 30 pin, you're also doing power in over the 30 pin.

Start up and shut down time? Does anyone with an iPhone shut it down... ever? I only do when I install a new app, but besides that, it's on idle. With "idle" battery life at ~30 days, you'd only have an issue if you never drove your car for a whole month. Other than that, you're comparing < 1 sec with whatever other carPC setup you want to go against.

Hell, the same thing goes for the camera. You're putting it in your car!!! Did you want a camera? Was that a "must have" feature for your carputer?

If you don't like it, don't use it. But do me two favors:
1) Don't post stupid arguments that have already been answered/addressed
2) List things you'd like to see it do. There is a large world of app developers out there that want to make products that people want to buy. Having those apps developed with a touch screen interface in mind is a win for everyone. "There are a ton of things my carpc can do that the iPad can't... 99.9% of the time you have to have windows running in the background." Yay, how about list "why," and then let the developers do their thing.

- being 'behind the times' - they copy things and make them look shiny, but in the end they are still copies

I don't see it being behind the times. It's like the iPod. They let people do it wrong, learn from their mistakes, then do it right. Allbeit sometimes scraping things they don't think are needed.

I've already commented on this, but will elaborate a bit more. A lot of the applications you find missing in OS/X, which eventually get equivalents, are copies of an original. This isn't true for them all, but in some way or another they are bringing missing functionality to your OS that is already present in another OS. You also say that the mac versions turn out better, but you are glossing over the concept of natural progression and the software evolution process. The windows versions will can always copy the 'good things' back into their version from the mac version, as well as add some new features, leaving the mac version behind once again. This cycle is doomed to repeat itself so long as Apple is just copying things and making them shiny, and while other people are following suit in "defense" of them.

you missed the point. Its UI that apple and apple devs spend time on. They think that is very important, and windows never gets the awesome UI's.

The only way I can accomplish this on my macs is to install Windows on them (if the purpose is a stable and functional desktop that I can depend on and replace quickly).

well thats you, like i said, after years of being on both, im 10x faster on mac desktop than windows. And this year, i still haven't found the need to intall any windows virtualization or dual boot. Its just not needed anymore.

Bets on how long before peoples iPads start getting warm/slow from too much crap running in the background?

im sure you didin't watch the keynote, but if you had, the whole reason for waiting this long to do multitasking was to do in a way that doesn't slow down or push the device. The method they use is pretty neat. They allow 7 multitasking API's for the developers to use. Therefor you will never have 10 apps running at once. Apps can save states, run music, run voice, etc... and that way apple can control the system yet still let processes run in the background.

Hes right, just letting 10 apps run at once will heat up and slow down, im glad they aren't doing that. when my jb iphone was running backgrounder, it would get hot and slow down, im willing to bet this multitasking is way better than backgrounder.

Reasons why I would chose another tablet over the ipad:

* Have a USB interface. Do you have any idea how many USB devices an average carpc has? Look at Sonixtacy, he has like 15
* Have an open programming API to allow developers to write and distribute applications without having to go through a nasty approval process and pay money JUST to dev. (This is partially a complaint against android as well)
* Be compatible with non-apple software (That is a pipe dream comment, I am well aware exactly what I'm saying but that is a huge reason for me)
* Have carpc related apps.
* Cost
* Multi-channel audio - Granted, not many other tablets have this.

Things I've seen, and liked about the ipad:
* Very slick and smooth interface
* Bluetooth integration much better than most carpc's get.
* App store, as much as I hate it, it is a bonus point towards the ipad.
* Battery life, it's up there above many of the tablets.

I'm open to anyone correcting me on any of these points. I think that if the ipad could do any of these, then it would greatly increase it's use as a valid in-car tablet pc. As it stands, it's just an ipod touch with a bigger screen.... which only solves one of the many problems you have with using an ipod touch instead of a carpc. All in all, I just don't see it as being a really good carpc replacement unless you only use your carpc for a very limited set of things, like simple headunit based audio and Navigation.