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Thread: focal versus audison? whos better?

  1. #81
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    The STEG amplifiers have a bigger power supply than the Audisons. In fact, the STEG amps caused the audison power supply to **** its self
    That comment was a fact, it's not made up, it a fact.

    Your comments about my being 100% sponsored, etc. are absolutely false and unfounded. I'm not sure where you get that idea from or who put it into your head.

    I'm still unclear as to why you have decided to come on here and start this out of the blue. There are plenty of people on this forum that don't believe everything I write, and rightly so, I've never claimed to be any kind of an expert on any of this, rather an individual who is deeply intrigued in this hobby and wishes to learn as much as possible.

    I've never in my life had dealings with someone with such malice. What have I ever done to you to provoke your attitude towards me?
    Jan Bennett
    FS: VW MKIV Bezel for 8" Lilliput - 95% Finished

    Please post on the forums! Chances are, someone else has or will have the same questions as you!

  2. #82
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    My problem is that you who spends alot of time on this forum thinks you know something about car audio, giving you expertise to a bunch of newbies. And all of your advice is very Bias towards Orca. Now yes focal makes great speakers Steg makes okay amps. Now as far as The audison amp ****ting itself please help me understand what you exactly mean by that. Hey maybe it's an installer error don't know the senario.
    I just would only expect someone like yourself who seems to be some what well respected on this forum would be more open than Bias to what is in your vehicle, you claim to be an enthusiasts or hobbists but have you ever looked up what a enthusiasts is in the Dictionary, let me help you.

    Enthusiasts: One who is filled with enthusiasm; one who is ardently absorbed in an interest or pursuit. A fanatic.

    now that is not what you portray.

    I think of you more of along the lines of a Bigot
    not sure what that means let me help you understand what that exactly means

    Bigot-a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.

    Wow. pretty scary huh. Think I nailed it!!!





    Quote Originally Posted by RedGTiVR6 View Post
    That comment was a fact, it's not made up, it a fact.

    Your comments about my being 100% sponsored, etc. are absolutely false and unfounded. I'm not sure where you get that idea from or who put it into your head.

    I'm still unclear as to why you have decided to come on here and start this out of the blue. There are plenty of people on this forum that don't believe everything I write, and rightly so, I've never claimed to be any kind of an expert on any of this, rather an individual who is deeply intrigued in this hobby and wishes to learn as much as possible.

    I've never in my life had dealings with someone with such malice. What have I ever done to you to provoke your attitude towards me?

  3. #83
    Neither darque nor pervert DarquePervert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hertz Fanatic View Post
    My problem is that you who spends alot of time on this forum thinks you know something about car audio, giving you expertise to a bunch of newbies. And all of your advice is very Bias towards Orca. Now yes focal makes great speakers Steg makes okay amps. Now as far as The audison amp ****ting itself please help me understand what you exactly mean by that. Hey maybe it's an installer error don't know the senario.
    And as a CarPC hobbyist, I am biased toward the hardware in my setup, too. I'll recommend a DSATX power supply to anyone. Hell, I'll recommend a Toyota to anyone because I'm biased toward the make of vehicle I drive,too.
    But what's wrong with that? We all have our opinions and preferences and we have every right to state what we feel is better and why. There's no issue with recommending products or brands we have good. I don't get your beef.

    I do, however, dispute your claim that Red's bias is toward any manufacturer of audio equipment. She personally has helped me in selecting audio hardware for my setup, and the simple statement "go with a recognizable name brand and you'll be OK" indicates no brand bias whatsoever.

    I just would only expect someone like yourself who seems to be some what well respected on this forum would be more open than Bias to what is in your vehicle, you claim to be an enthusiasts or hobbists but have you ever looked up what a enthusiasts is in the Dictionary, let me help you.

    Enthusiasts: One who is filled with enthusiasm; one who is ardently absorbed in an interest or pursuit. A fanatic.

    now that is not what you portray.
    Point out to the general public how and where that's the case.

    I think of you more of along the lines of a Bigot
    not sure what that means let me help you understand what that exactly means

    Bigot-a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.
    And I have a definition for you that fits: ignorant

    Ignorant - lacking knowledge or comprehension of the thing specified
    (Note: this is a dictionary definition and not intended to lower Red's status to a mere "thing")

    Wow. pretty scary huh. Think I nailed it!!!
    Nope not scary. Nope, no nails. You completely missed the mark. Is your thumb sore?

    Question:
    Why is it your sole mission to drag Red through the mud on these forums? Makes me wonder what you're up to and who you are, Hertz.
    Have you looked in the FAQ yet?
    How about the Wiki?



    Under normal circumstances, a signature would go here.

  4. #84
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    This is really interesting to me.

    Apparently I'm biased and only recomend whatever it is that Orca sells?? This just proves to me that you haven't taken the time to do any research into who I am and what I'm like at all...

    FAQ: What speakers/amps should I go with?

    If I'm so biased, why would I write a FAQ about picking equipment and make no mention of a particular brand?
    Jan Bennett
    FS: VW MKIV Bezel for 8" Lilliput - 95% Finished

    Please post on the forums! Chances are, someone else has or will have the same questions as you!

  5. #85
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    you know, I like this thread. Like you Red, I have once used Audison, but I am not using them because I don't like them...quite the opposite, I am replacing them mostly because they don't perform up to their specs. I had one of my LRx series amps in for service, and they did a test on it to find what actual output is at 1ohm, where I run it.

    Before you flame me Hertzboy...hear me out. I run Focal/audison combo in my car. Love the sound..hard to divorce a marriage between Focal/Audison, but...

    After the test, they sent in the results and I found out that the little Lrx is only putting out about 66% of it's advertized output, namely it's claim of 900w@1ohm is purely inaccurate. Total output was just under 650w@ 1ohm. So all this time I was underpowering my sub. Wow...

    anyway, it made me wonder about the other wattage claims. I, in no way, want to deter anyone from using their product. Audison does exactly what they claim in producing a clear signal and excellent sound. But they are severly overrated. That poses a problem with me. So I am replacing them with Focal amps. Not because I think Focal is better, but why not try the amps that are matched for the speakers. If they don't work out, I have a helix dealer, a Lunar dealer, a Brax dealer, a Genesis deal and even a Steg dealer I can contact to get another excellent amp, but man, those little Focal's are so sexy! There is nothing bad about being brand loyal.

    If I worked for Toyota, I would probably drive a toyota. But they wouldn't give me one for working for them. I guess I will leave it at that.

    cheers!

  6. #86
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    How was the Audison Amp tested???

    Hi, Larry Frederick here - I am the USA distributor for Elettromedia and responsible for all technical issues concerning Audison, Hertz and Connection products. Can you please advise which LRx model specifically that you are having this power issue with? As you know these are large Class A/B power amplifiers that run at approximately 50% efficiency(like ALL other Class A/B power amplifiers on the market)which means that the current draw can be calculated by the simple formula - Total Power X 2 (the 50% issue) divided by DC volts. At 12 volts DC that would mean you would have to have a 150 Amp power supply? Otherwise you cannot get full power (laws of physics stuff) Who fixed this amp as we currently do NOT have any authorized repair centers in the USA? And did they use the exact same device? or substituted with a "like" part. These amplifiers are REALLY Class A/B as their is a bias adjustment in the output stage (read; small potentiometer between the output devices) If this is not adjusted properly it would be like a car with a 15 inch tire on one side and a 22 inch on the other. Meaning it would be out of balance , out of "sych". (note: look at Focals website and look at their bad boy FP Monitor amp. Do you see any "pots" near the outputs? Interesting Huh?)

    So far in my experience (after 34 years - I was with Rich Coe back in the Audiomobile days, so I have done this a few times ) The LRx's always do more power into "dynamic" or "real world" speaker loads than resistors. In fact I just tested one of our new LRx 1.1K's at a dealer in Phoenix AZ. Into 2- JL 8W7's the amp swung 45 volts AC. AC volts is power (I know you know) the formula is AC volts squared divided by impedance = power. Thus this amp was doing about 1350 watts into a 1.5 ohm load. And , yes obviously this is a dynamic situation with the impedance swinging all over the place with reference to impedance. It actually exceeded its power rating, by quite a lot. Still after all this time I still argue with engineer friends of mine about this issue - as in "my opinion" this is the ONLY real test. Because if you really want to know what ANY amplifier is doing into your speakers in YOUR car. Go measure it! Load resistors are NOT a speaker, which is a highly inductive/reactive load. Testing amplifiers into load resistors is a simple test, but much like testing a car ONLY on a "dyno". This does not tell us how the car handles, brakes, etc.

    I am sorry your LRx seems to not do power in your car. Did you ever measure it there, in your car with your speakers? When the repair place tested it, what did they use for a load? What kind and current capability was the power supply? At what distortion were they testing at? What kind of distortion analyzer where they using? Audio Precision System1? AP 2? If you still have it we can fix it correctly and make it like new. We want you happy with your purchase as we pride ourselves on our products. I believe that we build the BEST car audio products available today. PERIOD! And I designed all the Phoenix Gold products from way back when (MS250, 275, 2125, MPS2220, 2500-and the MPH-6300($125,000.00 amplifier) So I think I am reasonably knowledgeable concerning power amplifiers. Hope that sheds a little more "light' on the subject.

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    Finally someone who knows what they are talking about

    Well said Larry. It's about time someone with some real knowledge chimed in. It's pretty comical reading some of the stuff that's being thrown around on this forum. Unfortunately, some people are using this forum to further their own agendas!

  8. #88
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    gotta love those laws of physics

    wow, some read.... I never clicked on this thread cause I thought it'd be boring, but it's not... pretty amusing really

    the funny thing is, one guy says he tested his amp & it doesn't do what it's supposed too, 50 guys read that & all think it's true.... the next thing you know, rumors start... all bull****... there is so much ignorance on the web it isn't even funny... everyone forms an opinion from what they've read....

    I think caraudioguy said it best:

    QUOTE:take everything with a "grain of salt" (even my stuff!!)

  9. #89
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    Well, it wouldn't be fair to name the repair center. It would look bad on me if they got a call from the designer of the Phoenix gold amps and head Audison guru at Electrromedia. I realize that this is the internet, and my word can be taken with a grain of sand, but...I didn't say that these amps suck, nor did I say that I didn't like them. I merely stated that they didn't stack up to what they claimed. For your information the amp was the LRx1.400 and at 1 ohm mono it claims 900watts. Since it didn't do that, I am trying to find another amp comparable to the ones I have. Incidentally, I own 4 Audison amps for my car, so it isn't like I just bought the 1.400 and just "didn't like it". I have 4 Audison amps, (2) LRx2.150, (1)LRx1.400 and (1) SRx2. These amps are beautiful, compact, and of excellent quality. They just didn't work out for me. And no...the repair center wasn't an "Authorized" repair center. You see, I didn't want to wait to send it out over seas and then have to wait on the repair and then have to wait on the return. Seemed just as easy to go to a local repair shop that has done many repairs for me in the realm of home and mobile electronics. They just relayed to me the answer. I acted on it.

    I do not hate these amps, far from it, but I do not like the output. As far as you sarcastically dissing the Focal amps, I feel you just lost some of your vast credibility. I found that in the Audio field (I have managed a home/car audio store for many years), you never downgrade an excellent product. You just sell your product to the best that you can while pointing out what makes your product "unique". Only the ears and feelings of the consumer matters in sales. What sounds good to them (through product and service) makes them a return customer, not hyped-up specs that they don't understand anyway.

    Larry, I don't doubt that you know what you are doing. I don't doubt that you support your product. The only thing I doubt is your ability to recognize quality outside your product. Good day sir.

  10. #90
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    Cool So we still do not HOW the "A" amp was tested....

    No power supply ratings? No test gear information? No "load' information? Just some nebulus repair facility? And they said it did 650 watts RMS into a 1 ohm load (Dales?? Or??? Wirewound ceramic "cheapo" loads? What is this??.... "My car is faster than your car sceniro" And we get to the drag strip and jump out of the cars on the starting line and I say "Lets race' and you say...Nah..lets just argue about it????

    All I said was go and look, at a competitors product, YOU figure it out. All I can do is point out what is REALLY going on. That you take "stock" in it is your choice. Where did I "dis' on this other product? I said LOOK at it.

    We are all adults , no one can make you like or dislike anything. I just wanted to point out design differences. And that is JUST the "tip of the iceberg" from that standpoint. When it comes to design you have to look at "attention to detail". Most car audio today is pretty good. BUT...99% of us "hard core' car audio types do NOT have a clue what they are looking at. Or get what they are talking about. For example there was a comment back earlier about a Steg Amp making the Audison power supply "****". For one thing the Audison power supply is 100 amps. If someone is "trying" to full power test ANY 1000 watt class A/B power amp (50% efficent), then "Yeah" it will "****" DUH!! 1000 watts squared divided by impedance is current draw (166 amps) yeah, that exceeds the 100 ampere power supply. Any 100 amp power supply. Wow! what a revelation. Not rocket science. So why are people saying this stuff? I don't get it? Remember to ALWAYS take any of these "comments" on any forums with a "grain of salt". Until proven otherwise. There is NO magic...Just physics! Thats what I have taught for 20 years in my seminars. Lets go out there and measure. Takes all of 3 or 4 minutes... Whew! Cuts thru the crap REALLY fast. And IF you didn't measure it, then it is suspect in my opinion, again...for what ever that is worth. You guys decide. Use what god gave you...BRAINS!!!! I've tuned over 1000 WINNING IASCA and USACi cars. Judged 300 events, Head judged 3 finals, help write 3 of the rule books, trained over 10,000 salesmen and installers in 27 countries and 44 states, have 5 design and engineering awards and 2 design patents. So what do I know????

    Food for thought my friends. Knowledge is power. The more ya know the more you know ya don't know NOTHING! Keep an open mind. Anyway.....Next week same time ...same "Bat " Channel

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