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Thread: Fan placement on case and screens!

  1. #31
    Sheepdog rdholtz's Avatar
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    Good job getting the fans sorted out, and on using the FanSpeed to prove it's fixed.

    Quote Originally Posted by pRoFiT View Post
    The dremel is more then just a small saw. It is the best tool in the world. Not only a small saw but it polishes, drills, routes. There are many attachments for it. Buy plenty of the cutoff saw blades. You will need them as they will explode into many little pieces if you are not steady with cutting . . . I purchased the metal saw blade and it works pretty good for plastic without melting it. The cutoff blade sometimes builds up a lot of friction while cutting and causes the plastic to melt a little. The metal blades seem to cut cleaner. But they do cost a little more.
    You can get a ridiculously large assortment of rotary tool bits at Harbor Freight for $16 plus shipping. I bought this kit in the local Harbor Freight store (on sale for $13, I think), and the bits are quite decent quality. Harbor Freight has an assortment of rotary tools, as well, but I haven't tried them. They even have a 12V model, currently on sale for the OMG price of $7.49. I would suspect it's pretty low on horsepower for the kind of cutting you were doing, though. At the other end of the spectrum, I bought my Ryobi on sale at Home Depot for under $40, and it's a powerhouse.
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  2. #32
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    OK, I got my dremal by the way, works great, much easier then melting, lol.... My cooling idea only works on a normal day, if it really hot, the PC is mega hot. Just touching the heat sinks without the pc being on is super hot.

    I live in FL, Nermin did a mini refrigerator setup. Im thinking of doing the same with one that holds like 2 cans of coke, maybe I can adapt it as a cooling system.... How would I do this and ensure there is no condensation? Please get back to.

    PS: I found this.... think its any good? http://technabob.com/blog/2007/05/21...b-mini-fridge/
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  3. #33
    Sheepdog rdholtz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    I found this.... think its any good? http://technabob.com/blog/2007/05/21...b-mini-fridge/
    Well, a USB refrigerator setup like that is interesting, but it's a novelty item, not a foolproof cooling system. I think you'd find greater success by adding more fan power, especially fans blowing directly onto hot spots and fans evacuating air from the case. They'll be at least as effective and probably a lot easier.

    I'd still recommend getting air in the bottom and out at the top (or out the sides at the top). The natural flow of heated air is upward, and trying to pull it down means you may be exhausting cooler air from the bottom, rather than the hottest air that you want most to get rid of. Try flipping the bottom fan so it blows into the case, or just leave the hole there and exhaust with two fans at the top.

    Sometimes research is fun, and sometimes it's frustrating, expensive and painful. That's why it's called the "bleeding edge."
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  4. #34
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    from what I understand that USB fridge works by thermal something... where one plate get hot (at the bottom) then the other plate becomes cold.. I was thinking of making metal channels that connect to the heat sinks then connect those to the metal cooling plate. im gonna try it.. its only like 40.00 dollar waste if it doesn't work

  5. #35
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Doing more research, it seems using cryo type systems create to much condensation. I am really starting to look at water cooling.... Not sure how this would work in a car pc system......... If not, I way use the heatpipe method and use the little 33.00 dollar fridge...
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  6. #36
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Water cooling seems to be very stable if you buy quality parts. I am thinking of maybe just ditching the case I have and builing a custom design, one that is beter intergrated into the seat and less noticable but can draw alot of air in. Then use a similar technology like in the USB fridge to cool a set of rods that air will run across caring cool air to the PC.

    If you had to start a case from scratch, what would you take into consideration? What type of materials would you use? It seems like the metal of the current case is holding heat..... Wood? Plastic? ETC...
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  7. #37
    Sheepdog rdholtz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    Water cooling seems to be very stable if you buy quality parts. I am thinking of maybe just ditching the case I have and builing a custom design, one that is beter intergrated into the seat and less noticable but can draw alot of air in. Then use a similar technology like in the USB fridge to cool a set of rods that air will run across caring cool air to the PC.
    Realistically, all we're doing in any cooling system is moving heat from one location to another. All of my experience is with fans. If I had to do it all again, I might consider water cooling, but only if I had one helluva lot of heat to dissipate. Fans are simple, cheap and reliable, and I'd be looking for ways to reduce the amount of heat I produce rather than trying to dissipate all I have.

    Still, if reducing the amount of heat generated isn't an option, I guess I'd consider liquid cooling. If I get the cooling pipes close enough to the heat sources, it has one advantage: no noise in the cabin, because I can move the coolant outside the cabin for heat dissipation. If the coolant pipes run outside the cabin to a small radiator, that radiator can have a big fan blowing on it, and the noise and heat from it won't affect the cabin occupants.

    Maybe you could run the coolant pipes out to the belly and use a thermostat similar to the system on your engine: when the motion of the car isn't fast enough to create sufficient airflow through the mini-radiator, a fan kicks in to keep the coolant cool. Or maybe you could run the pipes to the ceiling, and have a NACA duct in the roof. It would be very unusual, and an interesting innovation. Check this entry in Wikipedia, and you'll see what I mean.

    As long as I can get plain old air to work, I have no desire to get any kind of liquid close to my electronics, but I know some people do it. Most of them aren't doing it in a mobile environment where we have to worry about vibration damage as much. Still, it really does sound like an interesting system to experiment with.

    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    If you had to start a case from scratch, what would you take into consideration? What type of materials would you use? It seems like the metal of the current case is holding heat..... Wood? Plastic? ETC...
    I'd still stick with metal. Almost anything else will tend to retain heat, because almost anything else is a better insulator than metal. One thing you could consider is adding cooling fins to help dissipate heat, just like we do with processor heat sinks, and just like Voom does with its fanless cases.
    .
    If just enough is really good, then too much ought to be perfect.

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  8. #38
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdholtz View Post
    Realistically, all we're doing in any cooling system is moving heat from one location to another. All of my experience is with fans. If I had to do it all again, I might consider water cooling, but only if I had one helluva lot of heat to dissipate. Fans are simple, cheap and reliable, and I'd be looking for ways to reduce the amount of heat I produce rather than trying to dissipate all I have.

    Still, if reducing the amount of heat generated isn't an option, I guess I'd consider liquid cooling. If I get the cooling pipes close enough to the heat sources, it has one advantage: no noise in the cabin, because I can move the coolant outside the cabin for heat dissipation. If the coolant pipes run outside the cabin to a small radiator, that radiator can have a big fan blowing on it, and the noise and heat from it won't affect the cabin occupants.

    Maybe you could run the coolant pipes out to the belly and use a thermostat similar to the system on your engine: when the motion of the car isn't fast enough to create sufficient airflow through the mini-radiator, a fan kicks in to keep the coolant cool. Or maybe you could run the pipes to the ceiling, and have a NACA duct in the roof. It would be very unusual, and an interesting innovation. Check this entry in Wikipedia, and you'll see what I mean.

    As long as I can get plain old air to work, I have no desire to get any kind of liquid close to my electronics, but I know some people do it. Most of them aren't doing it in a mobile environment where we have to worry about vibration damage as much. Still, it really does sound like an interesting system to experiment with.



    I'd still stick with metal. Almost anything else will tend to retain heat, because almost anything else is a better insulator than metal. One thing you could consider is adding cooling fins to help dissipate heat, just like we do with processor heat sinks, and just like Voom does with its fanless cases.
    I love the idea about putting a small radiator outside, but at the bottom, wont have to mod the car to much. Only other thing I am worried about is what if it super hot, wont the radiator sweat, thus causing the tubing to sweat..? So many diffrent ideas, but all have some issue.... I really like the idea of Cryo Cooling, but I dont want to sit there and silicon my whole MoBo... Maybe there is a technique i can do to have only dry cool air get to the mobo.... but how would I filter out the water?
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  9. #39
    Sheepdog rdholtz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    I love the idea about putting a small radiator outside, but at the bottom, wont have to mod the car to much. Only other thing I am worried about is what if it super hot, wont the radiator sweat, thus causing the tubing to sweat..? So many diffrent ideas, but all have some issue.... I really like the idea of Cryo Cooling, but I dont want to sit there and silicon my whole MoBo... Maybe there is a technique i can do to have only dry cool air get to the mobo.... but how would I filter out the water?
    I think I'd be wary of a belly-mounted radiator simply because roadcrud could clog its vanes. You may want to look at some way of ducting the radiator-cooling airflow from a clean pickup; maybe a duct that runs to the front and scoops up clean air there. Pumping the coolant to a front-mounted radiator would be another option, but I'm not sure how cool your coolant would be when it got back to the heat exchanger.

    That's why I suggested the roof-mount or side-mount NACA duct. Yep, they take body modifications, and you have to consider where any captured moisture from the air is going to go, especially in heavy rain.

    Realistically, though, this is a major research project, and I wonder if it isn't really something you can add later. You could get the temperatures under control with the usual fans, and come back to this when you've run out of higher-priority projects.

    (This is actually a case of "do as I say, not as I do," because I'm right in the midst of redesigning the support system for my head unit. I have the first system I built, and it works just fine, but I want to make it better. Meanwhile, my carPC is not installed, yet, waiting for me to finish the support -- again -- before I move on with the rest of the build.)
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    If just enough is really good, then too much ought to be perfect.

    2006 Scion xB with in-dash Atom & Lilliput 889GL -- Worklog at http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/work...res-links.html
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  10. #40
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Well remember that USB fridge idea...it turns out they sell those pads for processors, casing and what not. I am in contact with them to find a way to cool the processor at a high start up temp without causing condensation.... i think this will be the route I go..... Not only can I use the thermalelectric to cool the processors, but maybe the case its self also.... Here is the site for people interested. http://www.supercool.se/default.asp
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