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Mini USB to USB adapter featured on the blog today

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  • Mini USB to USB adapter featured on the blog today

    I have been staring at this new mini USB to USB adapter and I can't really figure out the practical application for it. Help me out with understanding this.

    http://store.mp3car.com/Mini_USB_B_T..._p/cbl-117.htm
    - Project: Unified Car Control
    - Original OpenMobile Interface Designer

  • #2
    this is included in the updated bybyte bezel, and i believe mp3car thought that there was a demand for the part by itself..

    though i hate mini-usb.. i understand the need for it on the bezel, as there is just not enough space there for a standard sized usb port, but the fact that i require a adapter just to use it is a major disadvantage..
    Last edited by soundman98; 04-03-2011, 08:04 PM.
    My OLD 2001 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT:
    "The Project That Never Ended, until it did"


    next project? subaru brz
    carpc undecided

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    • #3
      I thought it was an April fools joke!

      I have several USB to mini-USB adaptors - they were about $3 each some years ago and are as robust as any small dongle (not an exposed PCB etc).

      Most of my things are mini-USB. I was even going to change the square (printer; type B?) USB on my Arduino to the mini, but they have already done that....
      In fact I am beginning to strongly dislike peripherals with the traditional USB (not as much as the square though). IMO they should all be minis.

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      • #4
        Thought of it as a april fools joke too. The person that laid out those PCB tracks done so with a shovel, what a piece os cr*p PCB layout, that's how you don't do it kids :-)

        (90 degrees bends is a big NO-NO, and the USB Data + and - should be the same length and be perfectly parallel from one connector to the other)

        // Per.
        Last edited by zapro; 04-04-2011, 12:40 AM.

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        • #5
          and this is the point where i skew the topic way off it's mark...

          zapro-- do you have any details on the do's/don'ts of pcb building? i am building some boards for a different project, and have many right angles in the circuit layout...(led tail lights)
          My OLD 2001 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT:
          "The Project That Never Ended, until it did"


          next project? subaru brz
          carpc undecided

          Comment


          • #6
            Sure. Have a look here:

            http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/hs_usb_pdg_r1_0.pdf

            RadioRon on the last post summarizes it up pretty good regarding the 90 degree bends: http://www.electro-tech-online.com/g...traxmaker.html

            // Per.

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            • #7
              i'll have a read later thanks for the links!
              My OLD 2001 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT:
              "The Project That Never Ended, until it did"


              next project? subaru brz
              carpc undecided

              Comment


              • #8
                But right angles are good - there is no inductive coupling!
                (Ha ha!)

                But that 90-degree rule doesn't necessarily apply any more.
                The common reason was the etching compounds in days of old, and that is often no longer relevant.

                Probably the only modern reason would be vibrational or thermal stress that could initiate fracturing from the inner corner, but there is usually enough radius relief to avoid that, else it can be added. (It's just like how crankshafts break without big-end bearing radius reliefs - despite them being their mainly to set the engine's oil pressure...)
                Even so, I think that is pretty unlikely these days.

                But if using backyard and primitive etching technologies, yeah sure, avoid acute corners.
                I have been seeing sharp corners of 90 degrees and less for several years...

                I reckon the 90-degree rule is another expired one... like lead-acid batteries on concrete; swapping ignition points polarity; and not PCB-tracking between IC pins (or do Bosch still have that rule... nah, they still use vacuum tubes don't they?

                Comment


                • #9
                  OldSpark, do you have anything usefull to add ?

                  If you check with every single PCB manufacturer, they add that you shouldn't do 90 degree bends unless you cannot do otherwise.

                  90 Degree bends is bad for signal integrity too, especially with modern digital circuitry.

                  // Per.

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                  • #10
                    Useful to add? At least IMO it was more useful than some ancient etching reason... And the "General Routing and Placement" recommendations of a VLSI manufacturer (who happen to use 90 themselves - not that they use chemical etching of course).
                    However I am open to specifics....


                    Why the signal integrity?
                    I did recently read that RF(I) has nothing to do with EMI/EMC and magnetics - maybe because copper are not ferro-magnetic (I can only surmise).

                    I provided the (non-) gave the inductive coupling as a joke despite its reasoning.
                    But I don't think we are too worried about corona effects (besides, that was apparently disproven by Mythbusters - mobile phones do not potentially attract discharge & lightning...)

                    Maybe I have been out of the game to long.... I used ancient 8/8 (thou) spacing. I admit I avoided 90 corners - I don't recall any although though I can't vouch for my power planes etc - though that was probably more for bling. I think even then either etching was out (as a reason) else the normal graphic rounding was adequate.

                    But as I said, I am open to specifics....


                    PS/addendum - maybe I am misinterpreting expression, but the tone is somewhat reminiscent...
                    And unfortunately this forum allows post-deletion. (Ha ha - post deletions... get it?)
                    Doubly unfortunately - caches exist. (A big hi to all my chameleon friends...)
                    Last edited by OldSpark; 04-04-2011, 09:55 AM. Reason: PS/addendum

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                    • #11
                      Bybyte had this to offer:

                      I've read the discussion about the item and the thing I found in common is that no one has actually tested the item to determine if the 90 degree angle affects the data speed integrity. Our techs have tested the adapter transfering data from USB thumbs (2, 4 & 8 Mb) and we have not encountered any problems. The 90 degree angle does not represent an issue in a PCB with such small footprint an carrying such a low voltage. The straight lines allows the manufacturing of the adapter with a single layer, reducing its cost significantly.

                      The reason why we incorporated the mini USB port to the frame is to ad the possibility of charging a cellphone or transmitting data or media from a USB flash drive (up to 8 Mb) to the computer. Without the port the customer will basically need to have a USB extension hanging somewhere in the car.


                      Our MINI USB to USB adapter is intended to be connected to the PC via USB cable (USB "A" male to USB "A" male) hidden behind the dash.


                      This item has an open frame as there's no space to add a fully insulated adapter. The item gives you the same service of a Mini USB to USB cable adapter with the benefit of having it discretely mounted and easy to reach at the front of the LCD frame.


                      The mini USB port is widely for several applications such as robotic hobby applications, system integration, etc., as seen on the images of head units below.


                      I really don't see any problem with this item.

                      Click image for larger version

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                      • #12
                        Thanks Jensen & Bugbyte,

                        But I think zapro is merely kidding,
                        If not, he risks losing credibility...
                        Originally posted by zapro View Post
                        If you check with every single PCB manufacturer, they add that you shouldn't do 90 degree bends unless you cannot do otherwise.
                        I just read of one that hadn't even heard of the rule!


                        It's primarily an olskool rule to do with under etching as I said. And thermal/mechanical stuff - but with square SMD corners and 90 corners where track meet pads etc.... (Need I go further?)


                        If you're into waveguides - fine, there is an issue. Or if those tracks are handling signals above several Gbs - but 90 bends may then be an advantage (ie, lower capacitance/impedance).
                        Otherwise the signaling issue is out - that is more dependent on surrounding tracks.


                        Maybe zapro is playing with my relations across the Sound Strait.... Those Nordics are schemers eh - aren't they Jensen?
                        (Or was it that I linked electricity with magnetism? That'd make me as smart as Maxwell, smart eh?)

                        For those that are concerned, a quick google should find a few good research papers or their webbed summaries.

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