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Motor City 160 amp H.O. Alternator - THUMBS WAYYY DOWN

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  • Motor City 160 amp H.O. Alternator - THUMBS WAYYY DOWN

    I'm green, MCR tech cust support is red.


    We just installed this alternator and it does not charge… Voltage is 12.4 at idle with nothing on… with load it drops well into the 11v’s.

    I am currently reinstalling my old alternator.



    that means that you are doing something wrong.
    did you upgrade wire? did you check for belt slip? does output change with increased rpm? if you upgraded wire how did you wire it?


    Yes, yes and yes.

    I had upgraded wire already in place, an extra (parallel) 4awg wire on both positive and negative sides.

    The belt is good and tight, also its brand new because the original had a tear.
    I also drove it for a short ride and didn’t smell any burning.

    During my ride it was clearly evident that the alt is not charging at idle; As soon as I rev the car everything in the car lights up, even the blower motor speeds up. So yes, output does change with RPM… At cruising speed the output was fairly steady around 14.4v. But again, as soon as I stopped at a light the voltage dropped slowly down below 12v’s.


    simple solution....you have an rpm problem that can be solved with smaller pulley, if you measure what is on there now i will send smaller


    The pulley looks about 2”and 3/8”
    Here is a photo of a tape measure over the pulley…

    More importantly, how is the pulley attached… I have no tools for pulling or pressing pulleys.

    And also, if the unit requires a smaller pulley to function at idle… shouldn’t this have come on the unit?! I mean this wasted a solid 4hrs of my time today installing the alternator and then reinstalling the original alternator.


    At this point I've spoken to caraudiobook.com and learned how exactly these units are rewound and why the need smaller pulley's to put out the same power as a stock unit at idle; I have also been informed by other ClubGP members that MCR did the SAME thing to them.

    So I filed an Item not complete claim with paypal to make sure that I get the rest of the item. BUT this ends up in my mailbox minutes later.

    the pulley is not pressed on, you simply use impact wrench with 15/16" socket and remove, change pulley and replace nut. very simple. as far as pulley being put on here it is only in very few cases that the smaller pulley is needed. you cars rpm has to be slower than normal causing problem. when installing a high amp alternator there are always possible tweaks to the system that need to be done. also what is the deal with filing a claim with paypal? at any point did we tell you we would not help solve your issue?

    next email before I could type up a reply

    after thinking about your problem it is clear that a return and refund is best for you. send it back and we will refund purchase price.
    quote:


    The first words out of your mouth were; “that means you are doing something wrong”; Which is arrogant at best.
    I filed a claim to cover my bases, it won’t effect you in anyway unless the claim were to escalate…
    I appreciate the refund; the item will be mailed via Fed Ex this afternoon.

    You can also ”mutually agree not to complete transaction” on Ebay’s dispute console to receive your final value fee back; Also when you refund through Paypal they will refund any fees you were charged by them.



    ARROGANT? YOU DID DO SOMETHING WRONG! WHEN INSTALLING A HIGH AMP ALTERNATOR THE SYSTEM SOMETIMES NEEDS TO BE TWEAKED. BEFORE YOU EVEN QUESTION US AS TO HOW TO PROCEED YOU FILE A CLAIM. THAT MY FREIND IS THE MOVE OF A COMPLETE IDIOT! DO YOU THINK WE HAVE ALMOST 3000 + FEEDBACKS BECAUSE WE DO NOT TAKE CARE OF THE CUSTOMER? WE WILL GLADLY REFUND YOUR MONEY AND BE DONE WITH YOU WITH OR WITHOUT OUR FEES THAT WE HAVE INCURED.



    I’m assuming that the upgraded alt has a larger stator, which required larger gauge wire for the windings… With the limited space inside the stock case you weren’t able to fit as many windings. This creates a situation where you need to spin the alternator faster in order to have enough electrical potential to push out power. And you didn’t have the proper pulley on it, so the rotor isn’t spinning fast enough to create power at a 650rpm (stock) idle. The fact is the unit either should have had the proper pulley on it, or had more windings. The listing clearly stated that it produced 70-80 amps at idle. I don’t see how a slight change (say a 10% overdrive) in the pulley size could have created those numbers after seeing virtually nothing with the pulley that was on it. And decreasing the pulley size even smaller only increases the chance of bearing failure. So I weighed the options and opted out.

    But this argument ended this morning when I sent the unit back. So have a nice life.


    you must be some kind of moron! you tried to install one high amp alternator and we have sold thousands and you think you understand more of the intricacies than we do? get real! a 1/4" smaller pulley would have completely solved your problem, it was that simple. i guess we must be fooling all those other people and you figured it out. go away
    - ƒarrow

    www.myspace.com/farrow099

  • #2
    Great company, would do "business" with again....
    - ƒarrow

    www.myspace.com/farrow099

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    • #3
      thats funny... most of high amp alts have low volts at idle. I have one, and know of others that have high amp units. None of which are worth **** off idle, even though they are supposedly putting out more current at idle that the stocker. The low voltage thing was a killer for me. I took mine off like you, who has time, or wants to upgrade to dimming lights.
      Setup:
      Dynaudio 240GT
      PPI PC4100, PPI PC2350
      Zapco DSP6
      ADS DAC
      Testing new board (Albatron KI690-AM2)

      "I dont know if complaints were filed, or mistakes were made, but feelings were hurt." -Krystal Washington

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      • #4
        thats why you do serious research before you buy an alternator.

        I plan on buying a police alternator for my car. Basically its the same alternator that they put in Police Intrepids. Chrysler sells it for 300. Puts out 30 more amps than stock and alot more amps on idle.
        Car : 00' Chrysler 300M
        Speakers : Rainbow Audio SLC 265 | Subs : Diamond Audio D6 12" Subs X2
        Amp's : Hifonics ZXi 6006 AB | Hifonics BXi 1606 D
        CarPC: HP Laptop AMD Sempron 3000+ | 1.5GB RAM | DVD+RW | 80GB 5400RPM HD | ATI R200 Video

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Farrow099 View Post
          Great company, would do "business" with again....
          As proph said, HO alternators do not put out very much power at low RPM's. This is a common thing. As far as I am concerned, you bought a product that you did not research. When they say 70 amps at idle, that could mean anything. My rx330 idles around 1000rpm, where as my civic idles close to 150-200. It all depends what you have. So a blanket statement like "70A at idle" should be taken cautiously.

          I think you are completely in the wrong here. They guy sold you a HO alternator, and you did not realize that the downside of a HO alternator is exactly what you mention. On some cars, a smaller puller is required to make more power if you will be city driving and your car has a low idle. Simple math/physics.

          If you are getting your money back, and he is getting his alternator back, then this is a moot point, but still you should know what you are buying.
          Fusion Brain Version 6 Released!
          1.9in x 2.9in -- 47mm x 73mm
          30 Digital Outputs -- Directly drive a relay
          15 Analogue Inputs -- Read sensors like temperature, light, distance, acceleration, and more
          Buy now in the MP3Car.com Store

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          • #6
            Originally posted by 2k1Toaster View Post
            where as my civic idles close to 150-200.

            That's HIGHLY UNLIKELY.
            Seems like your Civic's tachometer starts at the 500RPM mark meaning that what you're looking at is 650 ~ 700. That's plausible.
            For Sale: Carputer (CarPC) & RCA Y-Adapter
            Newsflash: Take a look at my unsold stuff above, thanks!
            Up Next: Make an OBD to Serial cable & Redo the "MMI buttons"

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            • #7
              Originally posted by DJiK View Post

              That's HIGHLY UNLIKELY.
              Seems like your Civic's tachometer starts at the 500RPM mark meaning that what you're looking at is 650 ~ 700. That's plausible.
              I have it set to maximum efficiency. My car is silent when idleing and it is a gas engine.

              Go Japs!
              Fusion Brain Version 6 Released!
              1.9in x 2.9in -- 47mm x 73mm
              30 Digital Outputs -- Directly drive a relay
              15 Analogue Inputs -- Read sensors like temperature, light, distance, acceleration, and more
              Buy now in the MP3Car.com Store

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              • #8
                Originally posted by 2k1Toaster View Post
                I have it set to maximum efficiency.
                Care to elaborate?

                Did you physically turn the idle screw as far down as it could go without the engine stalling?
                For Sale: Carputer (CarPC) & RCA Y-Adapter
                Newsflash: Take a look at my unsold stuff above, thanks!
                Up Next: Make an OBD to Serial cable & Redo the "MMI buttons"

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by DJiK View Post
                  Care to elaborate?

                  Did you physically turn the idle screw as far down as it could go without the engine stalling?
                  No. I didn't turn the screw down. What happened was I went to the Honda Dealership and asked them to program it to run at low idle. Basically turns the screw down electronically at a variable amount. It only gives the engine enough fuel to barely be functional (within honda specs). But if I punch the pedal down, it gives me the power within a fraction of a second.

                  Not sure of the specifics because I am not a car guy, just a computer guy, but basically it is now wasting very little fuel.

                  Cost me $80 for the "tuning". I believe it was a ECU flash to a leaner run or something. 7th gen Honda civics usually get around 32mpg. I can get around 39 to 42 if I am doing 1 nothc more aggressive than granny driving which I for the most part do around here.
                  Fusion Brain Version 6 Released!
                  1.9in x 2.9in -- 47mm x 73mm
                  30 Digital Outputs -- Directly drive a relay
                  15 Analogue Inputs -- Read sensors like temperature, light, distance, acceleration, and more
                  Buy now in the MP3Car.com Store

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Although in my old subaru, it idled too rough so I took a dinner mint and some duct tape and taped it back there. That "idled" around 1500rpm! It was old and dying. It was my last hope at that point!
                    Fusion Brain Version 6 Released!
                    1.9in x 2.9in -- 47mm x 73mm
                    30 Digital Outputs -- Directly drive a relay
                    15 Analogue Inputs -- Read sensors like temperature, light, distance, acceleration, and more
                    Buy now in the MP3Car.com Store

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by 2k1Toaster View Post
                      No. I didn't turn the screw down. What happened was I went to the Honda Dealership and asked them to program it to run at low idle. Basically turns the screw down electronically at a variable amount. It only gives the engine enough fuel to barely be functional (within honda specs). But if I punch the pedal down, it gives me the power within a fraction of a second.
                      That's very interesting...
                      Do your Power Steering, Air Conditioning, and Alternator still function OK while idling?
                      For Sale: Carputer (CarPC) & RCA Y-Adapter
                      Newsflash: Take a look at my unsold stuff above, thanks!
                      Up Next: Make an OBD to Serial cable & Redo the "MMI buttons"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DJiK View Post
                        That's very interesting...
                        Do your Power Steering, Air Conditioning, and Alternator still function OK while idling?
                        Well my alternator is stock, and it is able to power everything in my car no hiccups while idleing. I know when I am coasting the 2.5 miles down my mountainside at idle, the power steering still works. And for hvac, I notice the fans drop a bit when it idles, but I think it did that before too. Some feature to make the idle quieter by lower the fan noise or something. Does yours do that too? Well my fans don't lower more than I think they always do.
                        Fusion Brain Version 6 Released!
                        1.9in x 2.9in -- 47mm x 73mm
                        30 Digital Outputs -- Directly drive a relay
                        15 Analogue Inputs -- Read sensors like temperature, light, distance, acceleration, and more
                        Buy now in the MP3Car.com Store

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Crappy customer service for sure. I wish say as others have said most HO Alternators do lose idle output for larger mid/high RPM output. Which is why most of them will come with a 2" pulley to help. Alot of foreign cars idle really low so you'll find a 1 5/8" or a 2" pulley could be the solution to your problems and they are very easy to change out. My Hyundai idle's around 750 rpm.

                          Having said that I have had good experiences with Iraggi and Mechman alternators which both put out more than my stock alternator at idle.

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                          • #14
                            150 rpm... ... ... I'm w/ you DJ. Something idling that low would totatally loose power steering. The a/c would be nil, and the if you left the car idling for an hour it would probably drain the battery. No disrespect 2k1 but it just doesnt seem likely.

                            Back to the subject at hand.
                            Setup:
                            Dynaudio 240GT
                            PPI PC4100, PPI PC2350
                            Zapco DSP6
                            ADS DAC
                            Testing new board (Albatron KI690-AM2)

                            "I dont know if complaints were filed, or mistakes were made, but feelings were hurt." -Krystal Washington

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                            • #15
                              READ MY PREVIOUS POST (last on the first page): ITS FUNNY!!

                              Just so we are clear guys I chatted with a the gentleman who runs caraudiobook.com; a friend of bcae1.com.

                              He cleared up some of the confusion regarding rewound alternators... Here is the meat of it:

                              Larger wire is needed to handle the additional current. A stock case will not have much room inside so there will be less windings than a stock alternator due to the larger wire being used. Because of this a low rpm on the engine combined with less turns of wire could cause problems for the regulator. Less windings means less voltage capability so you have to spin it faster to get the voltage up. If you have an upgraded alternator that is a rewind in an OEM case then this could cause the problem you're experiencing.
                              Ok so i understand the situation as this: The upgraded stator produces more power which requires thicker gauge wire… and the lack of space creates a situation where there are less windings, which in turn creates less potential for electrical flow (which is what voltage stands for)... which shouldn't matter because the larger stator creates more amperage (a measure of electron flow per second) and the voltage regulator takes care of the voltage to amperage ratio. However, if the alternator is not setup properly and spinning too slow then the fewer windings will not pump out enough power and cause the voltage regulator trouble (it won't be able to provide the desired voltage).

                              My gtp idles around 650-700... The fact is even their own website states that their units come with a smaller pulley installed; Mine didn't; And the guy was a total douche to me!

                              There is more discussion about this here as well:
                              http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.as...mode=1&smode=1
                              - ƒarrow

                              www.myspace.com/farrow099

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