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  • Grounding Tutorial or Best Practices Guide

    I need some advice so I am looking for a Grounding Tutorial, not providing one, sorry.

    I'm planning on putting an Opus 150W PSU in a Casetronic C137 and mounting it underneath the passenger seat. I'm going to use rubber grommets to mount the case to the seat to absorb some vibration.

    A
    1. So I figure no smaller than 8 gauge wire (+ and ground) from the battery to the OPUS. ??
    2. What gauge does the OPUS use for this connection?
    3. Is it alright to tap into the ignition wire going to my car stereo for the OPUS ignition detection connection?
    4. I understand that I need to ground the case(?) and that the seat rail is acceptable, or would it be best to have another ground wire to the battery so that I can have a common ground for any extra grounding that's needed?
    5. Do I need to separately ground any of the components in the case?
    I have a SlimDVD drive which is bolted to the metal cage of my in-dash car stereo via a metal bracket. the DVD drive connects to the mobo via a firewire bridge and 6ft of cable. I have to run a 5v line from the OPUS to power the DVD/bridge

    Also mounted to the metal cage of my car stereo is a 6in1 USB 2.0 media card reader, which uses (2) separate 4 pin motherboard header cables, ie 8 pins not the typical 9, so it does not have that fat ground wire at pin 9. I have connected the headers to a single 10 pin female type A double connector, and then I use (2) 6 ft extension cable connect to mobo. (talk about jimmy rigged)

    Both the DVD and card reader are mounted to the cage with a metal bracket that has a thick coating/paint (thick paint chips, if you bend it) so it's probably not very good grounding

    B
    1. I assume the Stereo/DVD/Media Reader will share "existing" grounding via the stereo ground, since they are all bolted together, true/false? Is this good/bad?
    2. Should I create a 9 pin ground from the card reader to the 10 pin female type A double connector?
    3. I've seen some people say to re-ground stereo to chassis, necessary or advisable?
    4. Should I try to isolate the DVD/Media from the Stereo and have separate ground.
    I am running sound via a auxiliary line with a stereo mini-jack from mobo to CD Changer's 10-pin DIN connector port on Stereo.

    C
    any issues here? some say disconnect the ground wire??
    Last major component is the Lilliput LCD, with a 12v line from OPUS and Metal bracket mounted to frame.

    D
    Is grounding necessary, if so, where do I connect the ground?

    For the powered devices that are external to the case, i.e DVD and LCD, is the power line ground to the OPUS not enough?

    Am I likely to create ground loops?

    Sorry, if I've asked a stupid question. But as you can see, I'm completely ignorant about grounding, and would really appreciate some help so that I have an idea of what I'm getting into before I start pulling wires everywhere and creating a few sparks

    Thanks

    PS: Sorry for the long post
    Scott

    MCS-PC
    Epia M-10000
    XP Pro; 512MB; 60GB (2.5")
    Panasonic Slot SlimDVD/CD-RW
    7" Lilliput (Touchscreen)
    Casetronic C137 w/ 90W PSU (Temp)
    19V Laptop Adapter (Temp)

  • #2
    Originally posted by ose-ml320
    I need some advice so I am looking for a Grounding Tutorial, not providing one, sorry.

    I'm planning on putting an Opus 150W PSU in a Casetronic C137 and mounting it underneath the passenger seat. I'm going to use rubber grommets to mount the case to the seat to absorb some vibration.

    A
    1. So I figure no smaller than 8 gauge wire (+ and ground) from the battery to the OPUS. ??
    2. What gauge does the OPUS use for this connection?
    3. Is it alright to tap into the ignition wire going to my car stereo for the OPUS ignition detection connection?
    4. I understand that I need to ground the case(?) and that the seat rail is acceptable, or would it be best to have another ground wire to the battery so that I can have a common ground for any extra grounding that's needed?
    5. Do I need to separately ground any of the components in the case?
    I have a SlimDVD drive which is bolted to the metal cage of my in-dash car stereo via a metal bracket. the DVD drive connects to the mobo via a firewire bridge and 6ft of cable. I have to run a 5v line from the OPUS to power the DVD/bridge

    Also mounted to the metal cage of my car stereo is a 6in1 USB 2.0 media card reader, which uses (2) separate 4 pin motherboard header cables, ie 8 pins not the typical 9, so it does not have that fat ground wire at pin 9. I have connected the headers to a single 10 pin female type A double connector, and then I use (2) 6 ft extension cable connect to mobo. (talk about jimmy rigged)

    Both the DVD and card reader are mounted to the cage with a metal bracket that has a thick coating/paint (thick paint chips, if you bend it) so it's probably not very good grounding

    B
    1. I assume the Stereo/DVD/Media Reader will share "existing" grounding via the stereo ground, since they are all bolted together, true/false? Is this good/bad?
    2. Should I create a 9 pin ground from the card reader to the 10 pin female type A double connector?
    3. I've seen some people say to re-ground stereo to chassis, necessary or advisable?
    4. Should I try to isolate the DVD/Media from the Stereo and have separate ground.
    I am running sound via a auxiliary line with a stereo mini-jack from mobo to CD Changer's 10-pin DIN connector port on Stereo.

    C
    any issues here? some say disconnect the ground wire??
    Last major component is the Lilliput LCD, with a 12v line from OPUS and Metal bracket mounted to frame.

    D
    Is grounding necessary, if so, where do I connect the ground?

    For the powered devices that are external to the case, i.e DVD and LCD, is the power line ground to the OPUS not enough?

    Am I likely to create ground loops?

    Sorry, if I've asked a stupid question. But as you can see, I'm completely ignorant about grounding, and would really appreciate some help so that I have an idea of what I'm getting into before I start pulling wires everywhere and creating a few sparks

    Thanks

    PS: Sorry for the long post
    you gots a PM
    BossTone74

    Comment


    • #3
      what were the answers as I'm sure other people would like to know...



      Adam
      Toyota Supra TT | EPIA MII 10000 | 256Mb DDR RAM | Indash VGA | OPUS 150W | 80Gb HDD | GPS | 802.11b | GPRS

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by bosstone74
        you gots a PM
        please post here too, as others are interested in the answers
        STATUS: Planning / In Progress / Completed
        COMPLETE: [*********] 100%
        CAR: '02 Mitsubishi Lancer OZ Rally
        SYSTEM: EPIA M10000
        GPS: HaiCOMM 303e GPS, Routis 2004
        DISPLAY: 7" Xenarc 700TSV
        POWER: OPUS PW-70a + ITPS Combo
        MISC: DVD, WLAN

        Comment


        • #6
          Yeah, I thought they were good questions too. Unfortunately, I never got the OPUS, and the OPUS User's Guide that Bosstone sent me didn't answer any of the fundamental grounding questions. sorry, I can't be of any more help.


          EDIT "fundamental grounding questions" unrelated to the installation of the OPUS.
          Scott

          MCS-PC
          Epia M-10000
          XP Pro; 512MB; 60GB (2.5")
          Panasonic Slot SlimDVD/CD-RW
          7" Lilliput (Touchscreen)
          Casetronic C137 w/ 90W PSU (Temp)
          19V Laptop Adapter (Temp)

          Comment


          • #7
            I'll take a stab at answering these questions. My background (30+ yrs.) (yes I am over 40) is in industrial electro-mechanical design & installation.
            First off, the Opus is 150 watts, protected with a 15 amp fuse (150w/12v=12.5a). The wire size required to supply 15amps is at a minimum 14 ga. I would use 12 ga. just to be safe. 12 ga. is rated at 20 amps. and would more than make up for any voltage loss over distance or heat. The ground wires should be as short as possible and to terminate at common points in relation to each other to help eliminate picking up any extranious RF interference. Many of these points can be found throughout the cars chassis. It is also important to note here that you should verify that the cars chassis is BONDED well to the frame/altenator/negative terminal on the battery. Make sure the connections you make are to bare metal scraped of any paint/coatings etc.
            This brings up the nature of BONDING which is an entirely different practice than GROUNDING but equally important. USUALLY in the individual devices DVD drives, power supplies, head units etc. the manufacturer of these devices BONDS the case or chassis to the negative supply, but not always. Therefore it is a good idea to bond these cases or chassis to the cars chassis and/or each other, again keeping in mind to keep these connections as short as possible. The theory behind this is to bring all of these devices (car chassis included) to the same potential (level) so there is NO current flow from one to the other thereby creating paths for induced voltage (noise). Hope this helps.
            Let the flamming begin!
            System:
            Epia M1000 w/512MB PC2100, Xenarc 700TS, ATI 7500 PCI, OPUS 150 PSU, 2.5 40GB 5400 HDD, 802.11g PCI, Slim Slot DVDR,
            Gyration RF Kybrd, OBDII adpt. + sftwr, XP pro, iGuidance/Royaltek GPS NAV, XMPCR, Kenwd KAC-8401 4 chnl amp, 10" pwd sub

            Comment


            • #8
              Originally posted by ose-ml320
              Yeah, I thought they were good questions too. Unfortunately, I never got the OPUS, and the OPUS User's Guide that Bosstone sent me didn't answer any of the fundamental grounding questions. sorry, I can't be of any more help.

              They were good questions, that's why I had sent you the users guide that tells you the proper way to set up the OPUS. The only thing that I have hooked up for power, is from the battery to the opus...then I just use the power supply itself to power my LCD, GPS, and Drives.

              black goes to the NEG Terminal of your Battery
              Red goes to the Poss side of the battery (put a fuse in between the terminal and the wire)
              Yellow goes to any wire that show 12v when you turn the car on or in the crank (key) position.

              All of you other ****....just hook it up like you would to your in home computer.

              I'm a music teacher man...if I can read the users guide and figure it out....anyone can!


              Oh yeah....Straight from the guide
              8. Wire the 3 pins DC input power connector.

              Pin 1: Battery Positive. Use RED color # 12 AWG automotive grade wire.
              Pin 2: Ground or Battery Negative. Use Black color # 12 AWG automotive grade wire.
              Pin 3: Ignition or Switched Battery. Use Yellow #18 AWG automotive grade wire
              BossTone74

              Comment


              • #9
                Originally posted by bosstone74
                I'm a music teacher man...if I can read the users guide and figure it out....anyone can!


                [/B]

                Hmmm, yes we can all read the manual, however the mysterious 'you've gots a PM', gave the impression that you gave a full 'grounding tutorial', hence the request for the info. I think we are looking for something above and beyond what the manual tells us. I am sorry we troubled you

                Comment


                • #10
                  The ground wires should be as short as possible and to terminate at common points in relation to each other to help eliminate picking up any extranious RF interference. Many of these points can be found throughout the cars chassis.
                  What do these points look like? Im sure its different for every car, but what should we look for?

                  Personally a friend of mine and myself build our own PSU (~80W output) which I mounted behind my LCD screen in the dash, I then ran the positive from the PSU to underneath my passenger seat where my PC is and used one of the 4 12mm bolts holding the seat to the car as neg (ground). Is this the best way of doing it? or should the neg (ground) go back to the PSU rather than directly to the chasis? Also, should I have the PSU closer to the computer, or is the 3 or 4 feet between the PSU and PC ok?
                  I get quite a bit of engine noise, but im pretty sure that is because my RCA cables are so close to the PC (ie power etc..), which will soon be moved/fixed.

                  I think I speak for many when I say that a good grounding tutorial from an experienced auto-electritian would be very much appreciated

                  Car PC v1 - 1999 - 2000
                  DOS 6.22 - MPXF - 2x16 LCD - 6.4GB
                  Car PC v2 - 2002 - 2006
                  XP - 7" wide/touch - GPS - Tank batt relay - 100GB
                  Car PC v3 - 2008
                  XP - 7" wide/touch - GPS - 802.11g - FM/XM - OBDII - WWW

                  [||||||||||||||----] 80% complete

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    What do these points look like? Im sure its different for every car, but what should we look for?
                    Usually these grounding points are located near groups or clusters of various electrical devices ie. gauges, fuse panels, tail lights, head lights etc. and will usually have at least one or several Black wires attached with bolts through ring terminals to the metal of the chassis.
                    System:
                    Epia M1000 w/512MB PC2100, Xenarc 700TS, ATI 7500 PCI, OPUS 150 PSU, 2.5 40GB 5400 HDD, 802.11g PCI, Slim Slot DVDR,
                    Gyration RF Kybrd, OBDII adpt. + sftwr, XP pro, iGuidance/Royaltek GPS NAV, XMPCR, Kenwd KAC-8401 4 chnl amp, 10" pwd sub

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      Originally posted by Enforcer
                      Hmmm, yes we can all read the manual, however the mysterious 'you've gots a PM', gave the impression that you gave a full 'grounding tutorial', hence the request for the info. I think we are looking for something above and beyond what the manual tells us. I am sorry we troubled you
                      PM=PRIVATE MESSAGE

                      it's so cute how everyone needs there hand held through this whole process... you will find the answers and learn a hell of a lot more.
                      BossTone74

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        Originally posted by bosstone74
                        PM=PRIVATE MESSAGE

                        Well gee thanks, I would never have guessed that

                        and yes, we can all and should I guess what, one of the threads that will come up will be this one.

                        It was just thought that you might have something original and more detailed to say than the other threads.

                        like I said sorry for troubling you.

                        Comment


                        • #14
                          Originally posted by Enforcer
                          Well gee thanks, I would never have guessed that

                          and yes, we can all and should I guess what, one of the threads that will come up will be this one.

                          It was just thought that you might have something original and more detailed to say than the other threads.

                          like I said sorry for troubling you.
                          No prob, I accept your apology!
                          BossTone74

                          Comment


                          • #15
                            Originally posted by bosstone74
                            They were good questions, that's why I had sent you the users guide that tells you the proper way to set up the OPUS. The only thing that I have hooked up for power, is from the battery to the opus...then I just use the power supply itself to power my LCD, GPS, and Drives.

                            black goes to the NEG Terminal of your Battery
                            Red goes to the Poss side of the battery (put a fuse in between the terminal and the wire)
                            Yellow goes to any wire that show 12v when you turn the car on or in the crank (key) position.

                            All of you other ****....just hook it up like you would to your in home computer.

                            I'm a music teacher man...if I can read the users guide and figure it out....anyone can!


                            Oh yeah....Straight from the guide
                            8. Wire the 3 pins DC input power connector.

                            Pin 1: Battery Positive. Use RED color # 12 AWG automotive grade wire.
                            Pin 2: Ground or Battery Negative. Use Black color # 12 AWG automotive grade wire.
                            Pin 3: Ignition or Switched Battery. Use Yellow #18 AWG automotive grade wire

                            Whoa, didn't mean to insinuate anything negative about your PM response Bosstone. I appreciated very much the guide you sent me, but many of my questions had nothing to do with the OPUS. I apologize if you thought I was saying anything negative about your help. I was not.
                            Scott

                            MCS-PC
                            Epia M-10000
                            XP Pro; 512MB; 60GB (2.5")
                            Panasonic Slot SlimDVD/CD-RW
                            7" Lilliput (Touchscreen)
                            Casetronic C137 w/ 90W PSU (Temp)
                            19V Laptop Adapter (Temp)

                            Comment

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