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  • Windows 8 team focused on instant-on

    Just heard about this. Looks interesting, hopefully it can be done.

    Microsoft's key area of focus appears to be performance and instant-on systems. "Windows 8 PC's turn on fast, nearly instantly in some cases, and are ready to work without any long or unexpected delays. When customers want to check e-mail, sports scores, or play media they love to reach for their PCs because they can get to what they want quickly."

    In what appears to be suggestions to OEMs, Microsoft details Windows 8 investments under consideration. Focusing on POST performance, S3 resume performance and general performance optimizations for each of the Off states are the key areas of improvement that Microsoft is aiming for with Windows 8 and Windows 8 enabled PCs.
    (source)


    That's the great thing about the iPad and smart phones. No resume from hibernation problems, actually that's their default and expected mode of operation. PCs should be like that, even if you need to fit a small battery to make it work safely, ALWAYS.
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  • #2
    while it is good to hear, if microsofts past is any indication of their future, i think i will wait until the whole instant-on feature is safely(and more stablely) implemented in windows 9...
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    • #3
      Originally posted by soundman98 View Post
      while it is good to hear, if microsofts past is any indication of their future, i think i will wait until the whole instant-on feature is safely(and more stablely) implemented in windows 9...
      it'll be in windows 9 along with WINFS and all the other promised features that have disappeared from past OSs.

      That said, they did deliver all the feature they promised for window7 which was: "Windows7: better than vista".

      Note also that your phone rarely ever shuts down. It usually just turns off the screen and forces the cpu into lower profiles to save power. On ARM, the cpu will scale down to 0MHz when not used in this profile. This is usually different than suspend because you can still download stuff and receive calls in this state

      In a car, you could get away with doing this *if* your PC was power efficient enough not to drain your main battery. However, batteries do go dead, so starting up instantly in a cold boot type scenario would be essential.

      At any rate, my PC already does this: I turn off the monitor and it's "off" and I turn on the monitor and it's "on". This happens almost instantly.
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      • #4
        Originally posted by tripzero View Post

        At any rate, my PC already does this: I turn off the monitor and it's "off" and I turn on the monitor and it's "on". This happens almost instantly.
        Mine too, except I don't do anything other then press a button to start the car. However, my win7 hybrid sleep set up has its limits, it won't allow to be in that state forever - it will drain the battery. However, it works over one night, so that's good enough for now. Just not all drivers/MB work with that reliably, luckily mine does.
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        • #5
          I wonder if this would require some kind of collaboration with hardware manufacturers, or whether this can be a purely software thing?

          I dont really mind boot times to be honest, since I just use standby on my laptop. But for the carpc this would be great.

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          • #6
            Hybrid sleep shouldn't be draining your battery when you leave it longer than over night. If you set your PSU to kill power after a certain amount of time (e.g. 30-60 mins) then you don't have to worry. Any time beyond that it will simply resume from hibernation, otherwise it resume from sleep.

            Originally posted by RipplingHurst View Post
            Mine too, except I don't do anything other then press a button to start the car. However, my win7 hybrid sleep set up has its limits, it won't allow to be in that state forever - it will drain the battery. However, it works over one night, so that's good enough for now. Just not all drivers/MB work with that reliably, luckily mine does.
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            • #7
              I would settle for just an instant-boot bios in any small form factor. Seems like laptops only for now.

              Who knows how long it will be before win8 compliant hardware would make it into the embedded devices scene.
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              • #8
                Originally posted by RipplingHurst View Post
                Mine too, except I don't do anything other then press a button to start the car. However, my win7 hybrid sleep set up has its limits, it won't allow to be in that state forever - it will drain the battery. However, it works over one night, so that's good enough for now. Just not all drivers/MB work with that reliably, luckily mine does.
                One of the things we hope to show at AFKFest in the connected car demo is many of the cool things that you can do when the car is off. Things that aren't currently possible when the PC is off due to being suspended/hibernated.


                Originally posted by justchat_1 View Post
                I would settle for just an instant-boot bios in any small form factor. Seems like laptops only for now.

                Who knows how long it will be before win8 compliant hardware would make it into the embedded devices scene.

                Buy a Clarion Mind and rip out the atom board. IIRC it's got the instant-on bios built in.
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by SFiorito View Post
                  Hybrid sleep shouldn't be draining your battery when you leave it longer than over night. If you set your PSU to kill power after a certain amount of time (e.g. 30-60 mins) then you don't have to worry. Any time beyond that it will simply resume from hibernation, otherwise it resume from sleep.

                  I can't do that with my DSATX though, I have to trust their voltage monitoring system. When I turn off IGN, it stays on for 3 min, then Windows goes to hybrid sleep. When DATX detects voltage to be below 11.5v it then cuts 5v power to the RAM memory windows requires for hybrid sleep.

                  And the problem is, I still use an old ATX psu (400W, with a 20A rail) that when I connect it to the car (rarely nowadays, but it's nice to be able to do it) only delivers 11.9v tops, 11.6 under load or less (disk defrag, media database updating, etc.). That forces the DSATX to send a shutdown signal.

                  That is what I mean when I said the hybrid sleep is killing my battery, actually is the fact that I can't set a time for the DASTX to cut it off, not a high enough voltage to keep my battery healthy. So on the weekends I power the computer off manually - no hybrid sleep until Monday.
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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by tripzero View Post
                    One of the things we hope to show at AFKFest in the connected car demo is many of the cool things that you can do when the car is off. Things that aren't currently possible when the PC is off due to being suspended/hibernated.
                    But again...those are low powered devices...not powerless devices...they still consume far more power then a typical car's electronics in standby (even though they consume quite a bit less then even a ulv pc).
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by RipplingHurst View Post
                      And the problem is, I still use an old ATX psu (400W, with a 20A rail) that when I connect it to the car (rarely nowadays, but it's nice to be able to do it) only delivers 11.9v tops, 11.6 under load or less (disk defrag, media database updating, etc.). That forces the DSATX to send a shutdown signal.
                      i believe i have my dsatx's lowvolts set to 12v and i can get by with 3 or 4 days before it will kill the power to the 5v rail. if you want to continue using your atx psu, you could always jumper b1 and b2 for dumb psu mode.
                      my car: 2003 g35 coupe, 2.5ghz c2d cpu, gigabyte micro atx mb, dsatx
                      wife's car: 2004 honda accord coupe 2.4ghz p4 cpu, asus micro atx mb, opus 150
                      company car: 2006 chevy avalanche 2.0ghz p4 laptop, cnx p1900

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                      • #12
                        You mean if I jump b1 and b2 it will forget my lowvolt settings? Again, I know I could use 12v for lowvolts without a problem, it's the requirement to power it with an ATX psu for maintenance that is killing me - with it set at 11.5, the battery charge drops too much. I think I'll just forget about that...
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by RipplingHurst View Post
                          You mean if I jump b1 and b2 it will forget my lowvolt settings? Again, I know I could use 12v for lowvolts without a problem, it's the requirement to power it with an ATX psu for maintenance that is killing me - with it set at 11.5, the battery charge drops too much. I think I'll just forget about that...
                          yes, jumping b1 and b2 will make it ignore any settings including the lowvolts setting.
                          my car: 2003 g35 coupe, 2.5ghz c2d cpu, gigabyte micro atx mb, dsatx
                          wife's car: 2004 honda accord coupe 2.4ghz p4 cpu, asus micro atx mb, opus 150
                          company car: 2006 chevy avalanche 2.0ghz p4 laptop, cnx p1900

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                          • #14
                            Good to know, thanks!
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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by justchat_1 View Post
                              But again...those are low powered devices...not powerless devices...they still consume far more power then a typical car's electronics in standby (even though they consume quite a bit less then even a ulv pc).
                              Correct. In a sense we are waiting for technology to catch up. The sheevaplug is really a stop-gap until lower powered Atom or ARM boards come out. The sheeva's design wasn't hugely focussed on power saving. For example, the ethernet chip they used draws 0.1Amps at 13 volts itself!

                              I wish the intel morestown platform was available to us enthusiests. It would make an awesome low powered sheeva/carpc replacement.
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