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Thread: Returning to MP3 car after 7 years

  1. #11
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    OH boy! so much has changed! Your head is going to spin!!!!!!!!!!!!! I opted (finally) on a Windows 7 / Android based system. Windows is only used to control things like screens, amps, etc. The user though only interacts with the Android PC on a stick devices. Each seat has one, and there is one for shared use. Rather than fight to use my resistive touchscreens (that do not work with these units), I simply unplugged them and bought battery powered mini track pad/keyboard combos. Testing has yielded they are easier to use than a TS. The driver gets a TS, but that's built into the tablet.

    In all anything Android, and or iOS based is the way to go. There are just so many mobile friendly apps. I cant recommend Windows 8, in my opinion, its pure garbage. An obvious get people's money rush job.

    PS: rray, most late model Android devices has USB host mode. Its turning into the standard, because users want more out of their devices. 7 of the Android devices in my install have Android Ice Cream Sandwich 4.0. All with USB host mode. Then the 8th has Android Jelly Bean 4.1, it also has USB host mode. I was able to reuse so many of my USB devices from my Windows based car pc days. Anything that I couldn't port to Android, the Win7 system makes available to Android via network, example GPS.
    Last edited by HiJackZX1; 01-09-2013 at 10:57 AM.
    Nirwana Project, the Android/Win 7 hybrid system!

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  2. #12
    Constant Bitrate eugenweij's Avatar
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    your final choice will likely depend on the earlier discussed factors , usb peripherals and customizability or mobility and less hardware to worry about.


    you may have more factors in mind but thats what I could think of that define the options pc and tablet from the top of my head.

    personally I would go for pc at this point in time given the hardware and software options out there right now.

    I will keep an eye out on the tablet market to see if there are any interesting developments.

    Right now a pc is the only device that I can customize easily, upgrade if needed and does everything I want it to do.
    View my worklog here

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by mp31023 View Post
    Ok guys,

    I've been out of the loop for about 7 years, built my carputer pre-PAD/Table days. Now trying to get back in it to put a new system in the car. Not sure where to start or if I really want to put a PC in the car now that there are Tablets and IPAD now. I am not really a big fan of the tables and pads in that you have to always have to buy an app. I like the fact that on a windows or linux machine, I can use the purchased sw on multiple pc's if needed. Anyhow I am looking at a 7"(HDMI) screen that can be seen in the daytime, fast boot time, navigation, internet, and something that can run off 12VDC.

    Any ideas where to start?

    Also, I am seeing the Ardurino controller, why so many versions and can it be integrated into the buy of the shelf software such as Centrafuse?
    Hello, I'm actually a lurker that's been around for a long time. I was using the forum "back in the day" like you were for research purposes. My thoughts (I'm WIP with my Car PC right now):

    A) Installs are simple(r) now if you want them to be. IMHO, lots more pre-fabricated/off the shelf parts. You will still have to do custom fab if you want something... well... custom.
    B) 7" HDMI screen --> Lilliput 669. It's only resistive touch. From my exhaustive searching, it seems like implementing a capacitive solution is rather cost prohibitive. From what I've found in the last few weeks is that the driver isn't supported (correctly) in WIN8, I imagine SOMEONE will figure that out soon enough...
    C) The Arduino is a microcontroller, not a micro computer. It is used more for hobby projects, automation, and "real world" interfacing. It is NOT going to run centrafuse, as it's not a "PC." People use these more for robotics/sensor based projects, etc.
    D) I'm currently in the process of building something similar to what you're looking at [will detail hardware below], but I would actually reconsider the tablet route. It has the potential to make your life REALLY easy. "Sideload" apps if you want to try them out first. There are many free options for many things you're looking to do (NAV, music, etc). I'd take a hard look at tablets, as they can be drop in and go solutions. With that said, though...

    Quote Originally Posted by rray View Post
    I'm new to car pc's but after assembling my first one, I already started scoping out what components I want for the next one.

    I know it's priced obscenely, however I want this 7" 1280 x 800 screen with the 1200nits LED backlight with multi-touch capacitive and extra video input options for $644

    I was thinking I could do just fine with an Intel NUC barebones unit

    Stuffed with Micron's Crucial 256GB mSATA drive and Crucial 16GB DDR3 memory kit

    Power supplied with the Mini-box DCDC-USB-200 Intelligent DC-DC converter

    And last but not least, an ODAC USB D to A converter board to get 2V RMS line out of the NUC.

    This stuff would give me an extremely low power, yet high performance solution that could feed the highest quality audiophile's sound system, and the screen would be a visual joy to use.
    I'm currently building my CarPC with an Intel NUC. It's a 4"x4" motherboard in a tiny unit. I'll make the disclaimer here that I'm an Intel employee, so I'm biased. With that said, though, the reason I went with the NUC is that I wanted to build everything into a DoubleDIN slot, and Mini ITX wouldn't fit. There's also the bonus of having current gen architecture with a lower power envelope than I would otherwise get, too...

    My hardware includes:

    Lilliput 669GL HB HDMI
    Intel NUC (2 HDMI version)
    Intel 6235 WWAN mini PCIE (includes bluetooth)
    2x 4GB ADATA DDR3 SODIMMs (Didn't feel a need to go 16GB)
    Crucial 128GB mSATA SSD
    Bybyte DoubleDIN frame
    Metra VW Dash trim adapter with the bottom trimmed down to accept the Bybyte frame.
    Carnetix P1900
    Asus Xonar U3 USB sound card (the disadvantage of the NUC is that there is no analog audio out. You can use a DAC or a USB sound card. I opted for the sound card. Haven't determined if this was the right route or not..

    I'll note here that the NUC actually runs off 19V, which is the reason I chose the Carnetix P1900. It takes 12V in from the car, converts to 19V, and then also has a secondary output for the 12V your LCD will want. You can add on the 5V tertiary supply, which appears to be a simple voltage step down convertor (supports up to 3A).

    My gripes: I wish there was a capacitive 7" touch module that was readily available and at a reasonable price. Most of the ones I'm seeing these days are in the $120+ range just for the digitizer and controller. When I was researching panels way back when, the 3M modules were going for $40-60?? It's a bummer I didn't blind buy one back then. The Lilli has issues with WIN8 that greatly reduce the usability, so I'm still looking into solutions there.

    IMHO the above hardware (add on a bit for added peripherals) is crazy good for car PC usage. Fully solid state, no moving parts (minus the HSF), tiny (easy to place), reasonably low powered, and easy to integrate (Carnetix 1900 has you covered). Insane performance for the form factor, and RAM is cheap. Obvious disadvantages include minimal/non-existant expandability (unless you get the Thunderbolt enabled one, which can run pretty high end hardware once there's actually support and devices that USE it). That's just where I'm at after "returning" and actually starting to build something after a similar time frame. Hope this helps some.

  4. #14
    Low Bitrate mp31023's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    OH boy! so much has changed! Your head is going to spin!!!!!!!!!!!!! I opted (finally) on a Windows 7 / Android based system. Windows is only used to control things like screens, amps, etc. The user though only interacts with the Android PC on a stick devices. Each seat has one, and there is one for shared use. Rather than fight to use my resistive touchscreens (that do not work with these units), I simply unplugged them and bought battery powered mini track pad/keyboard combos. Testing has yielded they are easier to use than a TS. The driver gets a TS, but that's built into the tablet.

    In all anything Android, and or iOS based is the way to go. There are just so many mobile friendly apps. I cant recommend Windows 8, in my opinion, its pure garbage. An obvious get people's money rush job.

    PS: rray, most late model Android devices has USB host mode. Its turning into the standard, because users want more out of their devices. 7 of the Android devices in my install have Android Ice Cream Sandwich 4.0. All with USB host mode. Then the 8th has Android Jelly Bean 4.1, it also has USB host mode. I was able to reuse so many of my USB devices from my Windows based car pc days. Anything that I couldn't port to Android, the Win7 system makes available to Android via network, example GPS.

    You are right, my head is spinning now. For now I will keep lurking and play with my existing gear... Keep the ideas coming guys, it's appreciated!!!!

    DireDesire..... Where did you find the capasitive resistance screens?

  5. #15
    Low Bitrate mp31023's Avatar
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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by mp31023 View Post
    You are right, my head is spinning now. For now I will keep lurking and play with my existing gear... Keep the ideas coming guys, it's appreciated!!!!

    DireDesire..... Where did you find the capasitive resistance screens?
    Note that capacitive and resistive screens are two very different technologies. njytouch as is quoted in this thread has them, as well as tft-lcd-org (guy on this forum). He's got a website that is supposedly going to get them in stock in the next month or so. I'm not sure if it's the same panel, I'm not sure if the TFT-LCD-ORG version has multitouch, but from what the people at njy tell me, theirs does not.

    There are also places you can pick up the 3M screens still (or at least order them), but there is a long lead time, and I assume they need to fill a minimum order count to actually build them.

    Finally, there are sources for cheap digitizers on ebay, but these are purpose built for all the cheapo android tablets out there. The only problem is that these do NOT come with controllers, which are generally built onto the tablets themselves. I'd go through some trouble to reverse engineer one, but I don't really have the time or the excitement about the build as I did in the past. I'm just waiting currently for a fixed driver to get reasonable functionality in WIN8, or I'll have to run a separate front end software package. If a drop in replacement does show up for the capacitive touch screen, and it's at a reasonable price ($50-100), I'll probably swap when I get the chance.

  7. #17
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mp31023 View Post
    You are right, my head is spinning now. For now I will keep lurking and play with my existing gear... Keep the ideas coming guys, it's appreciated!!!!

    DireDesire..... Where did you find the capasitive resistance screens?
    I mainly see them on China sites. No where else. That was the reason I hesitated and went a different route, all though the keyboard/ track pads are also from China.
    Nirwana Project, the Android/Win 7 hybrid system!

    1X Ainol Novo Flame Tab
    4X MK808b
    3x Perixx Touchpads
    3x 7 inch Screens
    1X 7 inch motorized Screen
    1x Win 7 PC

  8. #18
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by diredesire View Post
    Note that capacitive and resistive screens are two very different technologies. njytouch as is quoted in this thread has them, as well as tft-lcd-org (guy on this forum). He's got a website that is supposedly going to get them in stock in the next month or so. I'm not sure if it's the same panel, I'm not sure if the TFT-LCD-ORG version has multitouch, but from what the people at njy tell me, theirs does not.

    There are also places you can pick up the 3M screens still (or at least order them), but there is a long lead time, and I assume they need to fill a minimum order count to actually build them.

    Finally, there are sources for cheap digitizers on ebay, but these are purpose built for all the cheapo android tablets out there. The only problem is that these do NOT come with controllers, which are generally built onto the tablets themselves. I'd go through some trouble to reverse engineer one, but I don't really have the time or the excitement about the build as I did in the past. I'm just waiting currently for a fixed driver to get reasonable functionality in WIN8, or I'll have to run a separate front end software package. If a drop in replacement does show up for the capacitive touch screen, and it's at a reasonable price ($50-100), I'll probably swap when I get the chance.
    That was my issue. No one wanted to reverse engineer resistive to work with my Android sticks. All though I think my solution on going with the wireless track pad/keyboard was better. The user can now sit comfortably and not have to reach for the screen. I use them only on the passengers (yes I use 6 of them, they each pair to their own dongle). The driver has a tablet for car centric stuff, but can also take control of all audio and screens to play video and music.
    Nirwana Project, the Android/Win 7 hybrid system!

    1X Ainol Novo Flame Tab
    4X MK808b
    3x Perixx Touchpads
    3x 7 inch Screens
    1X 7 inch motorized Screen
    1x Win 7 PC

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    That was my issue. No one wanted to reverse engineer resistive to work with my Android sticks. All though I think my solution on going with the wireless track pad/keyboard was better. The user can now sit comfortably and not have to reach for the screen. I use them only on the passengers (yes I use 6 of them, they each pair to their own dongle). The driver has a tablet for car centric stuff, but can also take control of all audio and screens to play video and music.
    Do you have the ability to run a USB Host port on your stick? Not sure what device you're using. You could probably get one up and running pretty easily depending on your configuration..

  10. #20
    Who am I? HiJackZX1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by diredesire View Post
    Do you have the ability to run a USB Host port on your stick? Not sure what device you're using. You could probably get one up and running pretty easily depending on your configuration..
    All 7 of the Android sticks have USB Host Mode. I am using 6x MK802 and 1x SS808 (MK808). Lilliputs seem to have the axis reversed when using touch, but my VM70 screens aren't seen at all.
    Nirwana Project, the Android/Win 7 hybrid system!

    1X Ainol Novo Flame Tab
    4X MK808b
    3x Perixx Touchpads
    3x 7 inch Screens
    1X 7 inch motorized Screen
    1x Win 7 PC

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