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Thread: Pc sometimes fails to boot. software or hardware problem??

  1. #11
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    Rodney beat me to what I was going to say about testing - especially with intermittents where its not unlkely to be a combination of issues.

    But re RAID I am talking about data loss & corruption of HDD files due to loss of power etc - NOT normal HDD failure modes.
    (And mirroring can be twice as slow es;e is no faster than non-mirrored. Splicing (striping) is usually twice the speed of non-striped.)

  2. #12
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    Well if you have had experiences with software RAID arrays that complete write cycles despite the CPU hanging, your experience certainly outranks mine. I'm sure others would love to hear how they manage to achieve that - I certainly would!!!

    I can understand hardware RAIDs doing that, but they require separate RAM and power to do that.


    I look forward to an explanation of your experience.

    Of course if you are still talking about disc corruption recovery then I/we have no interest since that is not what Settra's issue is about.

    PS - having specified & built & used RAIDs from 0 to 10, I am aware of the many variations of implementation - eg, mirrors that stagger their data writing order and mirrors that have independent buffers so as to not halve their overall writing speed. Of course to ensure valid directories given Settra's problem, they are NOT software RAIDs.

  3. #13
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    settra i think you have to focus on specific things if you want to get out of this fast. computer hardware problems amd compability issues are not a black or white case. the combination and possibilities of different failure causes are endless . so when you are dealing with pc problems you have to deal and exclude one at a time.

    a computer freezes where urs does is most of the times power problem . that means that someone l may oc his hardware without giving enough power , someone else may inderlocked again without adjusting power. When the pc boots up ( post screen ) then it uses big amount of power as the drivers ( that deals with every single device ) have not loaded yet. That means that a lot ram ( more ram more watt ) a cd a fast hdd > 4200rpm ( ssd doesnt consume a lot ) some usb ( they consume power without drivers loaded ) can force the psu or / and car battery to a semi failure ) not booting .

    The one thing that you have to do is get down in the car a desktop psu . This will tell you a lot. After that if problem remains then undock everything and i mean everything from the pc and try again .

    Something else you may want to try is to boot at night ( you got some hot already down there ) with engine running. a cold psu with good voltage input may do the difference.

    I had weird power provblems with mine once that i could find the cause. after a while i saw it was a bad earth contact.

    Also you have to look the jumpers and internal connections on the pc. clean the hardware with a air pistol ) dust and humidity is the worst enemy for high end pcbs.

    i am having problems with starts and boots now cause of a dirty vga . i know when i cleaned it they will dissapear.

    i am using the same hdd raid config for 2006 in my work pc. never lost even a byte. mirror raid is a must for computers.

    i am not getting into temp problems with ur pc but big temp are not good for psus

    but from what i can understand is that ur pc needs more than 250w to work well and you dont have them.

    last but not least . see if all of the cards and rams are properly inserted at their slots. also you did't mention the vga and if it has an additional supplu requiremnts . if so have you plugged anything.

    i dont know ur bios but gigabyte has good bios ( and hardware ) and a ctrl+F1 hidden settings. look at bios settigns with energy savings and try to change their default settings.

    m4 is a fine psu for me . maybe not the best but it is fine for what it costs.

    hope it helps.

  4. #14
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    Rodney - RAID is irrelevant to this conversation unless you can explain how RAID recovers data that has yet to be written to disc?

    Fixing mismatched info in RAIDs is handled by normal procedures & tools.


    But since Settra does not have a RAID, I don't understand why you are so keen to go off on an irrelevant tangent anyhow.

  5. #15
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    Edited - removed RAID reference

    So anyhow... Did you try booting the PC up outside of the vehicle on its own off a larger AC powered supply with nothing hooked to it externally?

    Rodney
    Last edited by redheadedrod; 04-14-2014 at 12:56 PM.

  6. #16
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    So yet again you are saying we agree. GOOD!

    I'll try to keep in mind your economic status. I didn't think that $25 was too much for a RAID 0 & 1 card - at least not compared to the $240 WD 80GB drives that went with it.



    PS - I just reread the thread. I was clarifying else correcting misleading or incorrect statements.
    I see however that I have a better understanding of a PC's operating system and how it may use a disk and thus how a hang or power loss can corrupt the system - especially in Windoze (Linux/*NIX is far more fault tolerant). Hence in keeping with Settra's problem I pointed out that IMO RAID is unlikely to help since he is probably not experiencing a disc corruption but an operating corruption (CPU or memory hang etc) hence pertinent data (FATs etc) are not being written to the disc or corrupted filelock & database data is being written.
    Last edited by OldSpark; 04-13-2014 at 07:16 AM. Reason: PS...

  7. #17
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    Ha ha very funny.
    So settra's "Pc sometimes fails to boot". you mention RAID, and I'm the one that goes off topic?

    I'm not sure when you stopped your personal attacks but it was directed at your:
    Quote Originally Posted by redheadedrod View Post
    ... except for some expensive hardware RAID drives they don't write to more than one drive at a time...
    .


    In the light of what you say you can turn off the power to your system - you don't have to shut it down (if you still use mirror mode).
    Maybe settra could use your hardware to solve his problem?

    I too have no understanding of why RAID came into this discussion other than as an aside for disc failure recovery. But once stated I did my usual thing of trying to clarify ambiguities and correct errors.


    Other readers: I think this is more an issue of transference - and I'm not talking data. And now I'm starting to stripe that behaviour.

  8. #18
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    Please, call in a moderator. If I am the one muddying this thread, I need to be told.

    I'll be away for a few days. If I have heard nothing from a moderator by the time I return, I will approach them.


    And what's this "ban me again"? I have never been banned from this forum, nor from any other forum.
    And yet again you say it is I that is attacking you?
    If I were attacking you personally, you and others would definitely know it.
    I have issued challenges and requests for clarification or reasoning (as I have in this thread - none of which have been answered) and I have accused your teachers of being idiots based on what you have said about them, but afaiac that's all.
    If you take something as an attack, then that's something to discuss or clarify just the same as clarifying why we are on differing tracks. EG - I am saying how RAID does not solve lock ups or ungraceful shutdown problems. I am in no way commenting on higher RAID data recovery features. Maybe that's something that hasn't been understood, but IMO to blame me for clarifying something that was stated is not me introducing that irrelevant something. Your RAID comment IMO was irrelevant to settra's problem, but I have often clarified such irrelevant statements - and with no objection to my knowledge. I'd hate to see someone invest in a RAID thinking it is going so solve a boot freeze problem, or think that software RAIDs continue to work despite a freeze, etc.

    If it takes someone else or a moderator to sort this out, then please do.

  9. #19
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    I just removed all my posting about RAID since it is apparent that Old Spark's life sucks so bad that he has to pick arguments that are off topic and help no one.

    Going back to my original intent...

    If you have a Journaling file system generally it will repair its self and you do not need to defrag it. Newer versions of Linux come with this type of file system available. I THINK the latest versions of Windows may come with one but you will have to research for yourself. The newer storage spaces for Windows 8 and Server 2012 do allow for file replication which would help prevent losing data. A Mirror RAID system can help prevent a corrupt system by having more than one copy of a file or cluster that the RAID should recover from. Realize that RAID doesn't insure you won't lose information but it is much less likely. If 100% data integrity is needed then a Journaling file system on a Mirrored raid would be hard to beat. I say Mirrored RAID because not all RAID systems mirror the data. Some variations are for speed and others are a combination.

    The original intent of the RAID discussion was a suggestion to prevent data loss in case of a hardware or software failure that could otherwise corrupt your hard drive. If you power down for any reason with files open it can corrupt the file system. A mirror RAID system is more likely to be recoverable from than a non RAID system and a Journaling system will recover from most power loss related corruptions. If you have to shut your computer off because of it being frozen and you are in the operating system it is the same as a power failure.

    Settra, I am sorry I partially bit on OS bait and allowed him to argue with me. It would be nice if OS would at least stay on topic and not stir up things that are irrelevant to the discussion.

    OS, yes I know what you mean about those idiot instructors. They each only had more than 20 years in the business directly and are part of one of the largest OEM providers of audio equipment. I am sure their company will fold because of their incompetence. They really should hire someone like you to be a consultant to check over what they provide to students to insure what they provide is accurate. I am sure that IASCA is also a bunch of idiots as well. It is only driven by all of the Car Audio manufacturers out there that are backed by countless engineers. When the information that they provide in their materials conflict with you I am sure you are always right and they should have had you edit their information because you know better. It is also nice to know the time I spent at ITT learning about fixing stuff was also a waste since they didn't clear their materials with you to insure they are accurate. It is nice to know that in your world things like OHMS law don't apply and other well established formulas and experience should be thrown away because you just know better. We won't even start on your knowledge of battery systems and power flow. I am sure that my 30+ years of computer experience were just a dream and I am not really working on a Bachelors in computer science from one of the better colleges in the country. You are so great at everything you do and you have so much information in your head you really should work on one of the X projects to put devices on other worlds. I should feel honored to even be allowed in your presence. How dare I want to challenge you with experience and facts.

    Rant off. Oh and OS.. Don't bother to respond unless it is to apologize and remove your off topic postings...
    Last edited by redheadedrod; 04-14-2014 at 01:25 PM.

  10. #20
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    all the above are very nice and informative, although, ABSOLUTELY irrelevant to carpc's whatsoever. ... and to be honest, if someone wants information regarding RAID, i seriously doubt , he would seek that info, in a CARPC forum... he would most probably go to a computers forum, where the experts on that subject, are....

    REGARDING MY PROBLEM:
    I believe the source of my problem, was not related to hardware at all... i'ts what i arledy posted... the "fast boot" option, of windows 8.... after i removed that, the pc is booting just fine....
    win 8, still have some compatibility issues, since its the first attempt of Microsoft to co-oparate with UEFI... especially if you consider that i have AMD cpu... (amd is known for compatibility issues)...
    so for the future reader: disable win8 fast boot....

    (P.S: the next month, i will be driving the car more often... if i see the problem returns, i will edit this message..)

    thanks for the help everyone!!

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