Project NiteVision - NiteMax + HUD + carputer

**Silentbob343** · 06-05-2006, 01:27 AM

http://www.eyetap.org/wearable/wear-...5/2005411.html
http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/radhlth/rcamcord.html
Seems they are pretty popular for home made HMDs, should be able to find some good info for it on the net

**shotgunefx** · 06-05-2006, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by Silentbob343

http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/radhlth/rcamcord.html

Good googling!

Thanks.

**shotgunefx** · 06-05-2006, 07:21 AM

Well, got it to work. It's pretty sharp for such a tiny image. It's a little rotated, but I think it's because I dissassembled it before realizing the "bulb" wasn't a bulb but rather the CRT. I think I can fix it though.

Didn't have much luck trying to get a pic though. It just overwhelms the camera with no flash, and with flash, it drowns out the pic.

I'm off to bed now, but hopefully I can do some tests trying to project it later tonight.

**jarofsonicmen** · 06-06-2006, 12:50 AM

OK, my latest lousy idea; now even more expensive!
http://www.mobilewhack.com/reviews/m...pt_ct_car.html

This puppy and a couple of first-surface mirrors...well, maybe not.

Anyone got a TV or even slide projector to see what happens?

There's some question in my mind as to whether focusing it to a distance of, say 20 feet, allows your eyes to focus at 20 feet, or if you have to focus it on the windshield, and the focal length is the distance from the LCD to the windshield.

I must read more on optics. Wonder if I can dig up a copy of the HUD design book...

**Silentbob343** · 06-06-2006, 01:00 AM

Originally Posted by shotgunefx

Well, got it to work. It's pretty sharp for such a tiny image. It's a little rotated, but I think it's because I dissassembled it before realizing the "bulb" wasn't a bulb but rather the CRT. I think I can fix it though.

Didn't have much luck trying to get a pic though. It just overwhelms the camera with no flash, and with flash, it drowns out the pic.

I'm off to bed now, but hopefully I can do some tests trying to project it later tonight.

Now you must get a camcorder and make a video of it working

**jammy_basturd** · 06-06-2006, 02:42 AM

Hmmmm, am quite excited about using these camcorder viewfinders. I'm guessing the image will have to be mirrored though if your projecting the image forward onto your windscreen?

Is there anything I should look for when getting a broken camcorder from Ebay?

**shotgunefx** · 06-06-2006, 02:58 AM

Originally Posted by Silentbob343

Now you must get a camcorder and make a video of it working

Easier said then done. When videotaping it, you can basically see the retrace, so you have a big dark band that slowly crawls over the screen.

Best I could do was to hold up one of those projection lenses and snap a photo of that.

Between holding the projection lens, and the camera, this is the sharpest I could get.

Originally Posted by jammy_basturd

Hmmmm, am quite excited about using these camcorder viewfinders. I'm guessing the image will have to be mirrored though if your projecting the image forward onto your windscreen?

Is there anything I should look for when getting a broken camcorder from Ebay?

No idea, and I'm not so sure about how useful it will be towards this specific problem. If that's why you want one, might want to hold off.

Hard to find much info, but from the very limited info I could find, looks like sony cams with these types of view finders are "somewhat" similar. So what will work, who knows. Well except for this cam (CCD-FX411).

Some need additional signals (hsync, etc) which would complicate things. I'd probably look for an older Sony, but again, unless you have another pressing need for a .4" CRT, I'd wait.

On the plus side, there's a lot of other good stuff in this camera, the CCD, lenses, etc. Have to finish stripping it down one of these days and see what else I can salvage.

**shotgunefx** · 06-06-2006, 04:12 AM

Just figured something out. Decided to try the viewfinder lens itself to project it. Works great, can project it to the wall a few inches away or to the ceiling. It's dim, but less dim than the nitemax projected with the built in backlight.

On the bad side, I'm getting more convinced that a properly projected hud displaying video is a no go.

Has anyone ever seen a video HUD? I mean anywhere? I see the F18 has some overlays and whatnot, but they don't look like regular video and seem limited to certain colors.

If you go and read that link above on the fighter huds, especially the later ones that have more then monochromatic symbols, it appears even with all that money, research and advanced optics, they don't get it either. That can't be bode well for us doing it.

I still can't get around the projection source being seen and I can't think of an arrangment that would allow the projected image to be seen, but not the source. Probably something I'm missing though.

Maybe it's time to get a Psone or slightly larger LCD and just aim for reflection. That will work for some stuff, but probably a distraction if you have any illusions of overlaying the road ahead.

I wonder if you could fake the focus in software. Basically munge the screen in realtime so it appears in focus when you're looking off.

Even if it's possible, that would be pretty heavy cpu wise, thought you could optimize it as the transform is static. If this is possible, it's probably the best route IMHO.

**Silentbob343** · 06-06-2006, 04:28 AM

Originally Posted by shotgunefx

Just figured something out. Decided to try the viewfinder lens itself to project it. Works great, can project it to the wall a few inches away or to the ceiling. It's dim, but less dim than the nitemax projected with the built in backlight.

On the bad side, I'm getting more convinced that a properly projected hud displaying video is a no go.

Has anyone ever seen a video HUD? I mean anywhere? I see the F18 has some overlays and whatnot, but they don't look like regular video and seem limited to certain colors.

If you go and read that link above on the fighter huds, especially the later ones that have more then monochromatic symbols, it appears even with all that money, research and advanced optics, they don't get it either. That can't be bode well for us doing it.

I still can't get around the projection source being seen and I can't think of an arrangment that would allow the projected image to be seen, but not the source. Probably something I'm missing though.

Maybe it's time to get a Psone or slightly larger LCD and just aim for reflection. That will work for some stuff, but probably a distraction if you have any illusions of overlaying the road ahead.

I wonder if you could fake the focus in software. Basically munge the screen in realtime so it appears in focus when you're looking off.

Even if it's possible, that would be pretty heavy cpu wise, thought you could optimize it as the transform is static. If this is possible, it's probably the best route IMHO.

Well, on a really long shot I can try to email a guy that works for Lockheed Martin on the F-22 doing systems integration. I wouldn't count on anything more than yes we have a video capable HUD or no we don't. Definitely wouldn't get any details out of him.

As far as the projection source being seen...maybe some sort of complex mirror arrangement

**shotgunefx** · 06-06-2006, 04:48 AM

Originally Posted by Silentbob343

Well, on a really long shot I can try to email a guy that works for Lockheed Martin on the F-22 doing systems integration. I wouldn't count on anything more than yes we have a video capable HUD or no we don't. Definitely wouldn't get any details out of him.

As far as the projection source being seen...maybe some sort of complex mirror arrangement

I wouldnt' bother unless it's for your own interests. Even if they do, it still puts it far out of our reach. Just reading about the F18 system and the optics...

As far as the projection, that's what's getting me. I've experimented with several different things, but I could always see it off the collimnator. Then again on those planes, the hud projectors are high up and facing upwards. Maybe there's a reason for that beyond cramped space.