If you have VIA Boards and NO SIGNAL message

**masch** · 06-23-2007, 12:57 PM

I just did some extensive testing.

After reading a lot of posts about people getting the "NO SIGNAL" message after logging in to windows, I have tried numerous suggestions and I think I've narrowed down the problem. There is no perfect solution however, at this moment.

I think the problems started with the latest EPIA Bios, for the M10K mobo its 1.16. This is when VIA enabled the unichrome drivers to be CRT, CRT+LCD, CRT+TV etc. For some reason, if you select CRT only, one day it will revert back to CRT+LCD and your VGA signals will go out of sync again. After reading numerous forums, the only stable selection is CRT+LCD in BIOS.

Now, normally this wouldnt be a problem.

However, I brought my 17" Samsung LCD into the car to do some testing, and I noticed that if under "S3 Display" you select only CRT, and choose 800x600, the display on my LCD monitor is not full screen, i.e. it only displays on part of the screen (centered i.e., the start button is somewhere nearer the center of the screen instead of the bottom left corner). Any resolution but 1024x768 will do this. Anytime the screen is not displayed in full in the 17" monitor, the VGA LCD (like Lilliput) will show a "No Signal" or "Over Range".

Now, if you were to go to S3 Display under Advanced, then disable LCD, then select 800x600, you WILL get the screen to display in full, i.e. Start button perfectly at the bottom left corner. However, upon rebooting, the LCD is automatically enabled again (perhaps because bios is set at CRT+LCD), causing VGA to lose sync again, and causing the dreaded "No Signal".

Some people have reported that they can get the display to show correctly if they go into safe VGA-only mode, remove the Unichrome drivers, then boot using default VGA drivers. Upon entering Windows, Windows will reinstall the Unichrome drivers and all seem fine. But if you are testing this stage, check under Display Properties->Settings. You should see two monitors. Only 1 is enabled. Monitor 2 is shaded out. Click on Monitor 2, it says on the bottom that display is NOT extended to Monitor 2. Now click on Advanced and S3 Display. Click on LCD. At the bottom it will tick by default that the display is extended to the LCD. See this conflict? Under S3 Display, it says that the display is extended to LCD. However under Settings, it is not. That is why its flaky, sometimes VGA works after booting, sometimes it does not.

So the problem is perhaps either of this:
1) The updated BIOS. I dont know how far back the BIOS versions go to identify which BIOS does not have the CRT+LCD option. I remember it only had the CRT+TV at one point, no LCD. This is the one that is stable, can anybody find it? More importantly is there a way to downgrade your BIOS?
2) The S3 Unichrome VGA drivers. Problem is why it cant remember and stick to the last setting that works. I mean, if you choose to disable LCD, it should stick to disabling the LCD. And why the heck wont it display full screen at other resolutions like 800x600 when LCD is enabled and extended?

Temporary solution:
- Choose CRT+LCD in BIOS
- Then using an external monitor (not your 7" LCD), enable LCD in S3 Display Device and choose 1024x768 as your primary monitor setting. The LCD must be enabled. However I cant recall if you have to extend the display to LCD or not. Try both.
- If you are using Roadrunner, you can have your Skin to resize according to your new resolution. Go into your Skin directory, open up general.ini and set ShowWidth=1024
ShowHeight=768
- I still have a slight problem where the font wont display correctly but I think I'll figure that one out some day.

I hope VIA releases new BIOS or VGA drivers for the S3 Unichrome. Most people who got their M10000 boards 3-4 years ago like me didnt have this problem because the BIOS version is older. Those that just got their M10000 (like me, doing another install) or updated their BIOS drivers will probably face this problem. I really wish I can find and downgrade to the old BIOS version.

**My4Runner** · 06-23-2007, 11:17 PM

Masch- I have been going through this same situation with my VIA Board and Lilliput screen. I have the exact same setup as you, and have tried all the same solutions you have done.

However, after I set the BIOS to CRT + LCD and started the computer, I went into the Display settings. I went to the Advance section and when I went to choose LCD it was not an option. I have tried every BIOS option you can choose, and it always comes up with CRT and TV under Advanced options.

Do you have any ideas for that.?

My Lilliput screen will show the Windows Logo with the status bar loading, and after that happens it goes blank then in green shows the "Over Range" message. I've looked everywher and can't figure out what that even means. Do you know what it means?

I have tried changing the display to every option I can, and still no luck... I am out of ideas, and have no idea what to do now.

PLEASE HELP!!!

**masch** · 06-24-2007, 05:14 AM

Do you have an external monitor that you can hook up to your Lilliput to test in the car? Or can you bring your setup inside?

**My4Runner** · 06-24-2007, 11:37 PM

Yeah I have a monitor in my house that I have been using. I can get the computer to show up on my Samsung 19" Monitor and at any display ratio, and when I was building my carPC I got it to work fine on the Lilliput screen. I had it all set up perfectly, touch screen and all. Then I installed the monitor into my truck, and tested it out with my Thinkpad Laptop. Worked just fine. But when I installed the CarPC in there, pluged it in... I get the "Over Range" Message. And I have tried everything you have done. Still no luck.

The only thing I can't do the same as you is get it to show the LCD option when I'm in Advanced Display options. It only shows CRT and TV. Do I want my computer to show up on an LCD or a CRT monitor. I thought the Lilliput was an LCD not a CRT, but what do I know.

At this point, tell me what to do... I just want my screen to show my CarPC.

THANKS!!!

**moleman** · 06-26-2007, 04:46 AM

I am having the same problem with my setup. I checked out VIA's website, and they have BIOS version 1.07 available for download. I haven't tried it yet. They don't give any instructions on how to flash the BIOS, and the app used for older boards isn't listed for download. I don't want to turn my board into a paperweight, or make the problem worse than it is now.

**moleman** · 06-27-2007, 04:36 AM

I finally got everything working again. In the end all I had to do was stop the S3 utility from running on start up. Just click the yellow S3 icon in the system tray, and clear the box for run at startup.

You may have to boot into safe mode, and uninstall the S3/Unicrome display driver to get to the point where you can disable the utility. I don't know if this will work for everyone, I have an EPIA CN-13000. Hope this helps.

**moleman** · 06-27-2007, 04:42 AM

My4Runner
If your monitor is plugged into a VGA port, then you want to choose CRT.

Over range just means the monitor can't handle the resolution. I think the max a Lilliput can handle is 1024x768, but I'm not sure.

**masch** · 06-29-2007, 12:20 AM

My4Runner:

Can you see the BIOS you are running on your mobo?

Moleman:

You are correct, Lilliput can handle up to 1024x768 but so far I can only get 60Hz, anything higher will give Over Range

**alchemist29** · 06-29-2007, 07:28 PM

I've dealt with the VIA boards in HTPC applications and learned this about them: They have some sort of load detection system on their video outputs.

If you do not have any monitor both plugged in AND turned on when the motherboard is powered up, the signal defaults to the VGA connector.

If you have a TV or A/V receiver plugged into the Composite or S-Video out port (if your board has one) then the signal will default to that port.

I haven't dealt with the LCD connector on these boards. I really don't think any of the boards I have seen actually had the header for the LCD connector soldered on. I know the Nehemiah core board I have in front of me right now doesn't have it.

From what I see of the Lilliput, it only accepts a VGA input. I would ask if you have anything else connected to either the NTSC or S-Video port. If so, disconnect them.

Also, be sure that your resolution and refresh rates are set to something the Lilliput can understand. What I would do is set everything to their absolute lowest settings, power up the lilliput, boot the computer and then work your way up in resolution and refresh until you find the best settings. If you hit one that doesn't work, you can always wait for the 15-second timer to count down and revert back to the last one.

**moleman** · 06-30-2007, 08:32 AM

alchemist29:
The problem is, that it doesn't default to the vga port. Everything is fine until windows starts, and then suddenly there is no vga signal. If you then restart it, and go into the BIOS it has changed the display to tv. Strangely enough I tried starting it up with a tv connected, and still there was no signal either.
I even emailed VIA, but was told that they could not help me. No reason why, just that they couldn't.

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