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Thread: 3m Enhancement Overview

  1. #1
    Vendor - Qube colin's Avatar
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    3m Enhancement Overview

    So the 3m film thread is WAY too long to get much useful information out of, especially with all the random comments. To sum it up, since I need this information myself, here's what I've found:

    Learn how LCDs work (a flash video showing every film's purpose):
    http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3...ary/optics101/

    A transflective LCD should go something like this:
    Code:
    From back to front:
    
    Reflector	- so many films sending light back, need to keep most of it
    Backlight	- obvious
    Diffuser	- to spread the light out evenly 
    BEF 		- catch light in all angles and send it out straight, 1 for each axis
    BEF x2		- this is the sheet for the other axis
    DBEF		- transflector sheet, parallel to first BEF
    Transflector	- to catch incoming light and resend it out
    
    LCD PANEL
    
    Antiglare	- scatters light, not a great idea due to sun angles
    or
    Antireflective	- reduces reflected light, index of refraction
    
    =======================================================================
    
    Reflector
    ESR > 98% reflectivity
    White > 96%, recommended from 3m's online helper
    And after sending an email to 3m, I got this response:
    Hello Colin,
    Thank you for the information.
    I forwarded your message to our tech service engineer whose response follows.
    However, since, we have already sent you four samples, which is our limit, you will need to purchase these films. I have attached our price page for your use. Alternatively, you may want to contact www.digikey.com as they will sell single sheets.

    Per Colin's e-mail. This is correct. ESR would lay on top of white reflector to improve reflectivity in the backlight. A gain diffuser that comes with the unit would lay on top of the lightguide. On top of that would lay our BEF II 90/50 Vertical (grooves running up and down), on top of that would lay our BEF II 90/50 Horizontal (grooves running right and left), and on top of that would lay our DBEF D2 400 (45 degree transmission) for this size type and size display and automotive display that needs the thicker warp resistant DBEF D type film.

    For any other display markets that are not in really high heat like in a car in the summer, could use DBEF E instead as that is the brightest DBEF but it won't pass automotive specs at greater than 85C.
    Im not sure why 45 degree DBEF is recommended, but I asked and hopefully Ill get a response. So, to take a typical LCD and modify it, you would need a sheet of ESR reflector, 2 sheets of DBEF 0 degree (unless you have a smaller display and can use one sheet, probably works for 7" LCDs where you can get one sample and cut two pieces out of it), one sheet of DBEF 45, and an antireflective film LAMINATED to the front of the touchscreen?

  2. #2
    Low Bitrate
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    Just ordered up some stuff, Here is what i ordered and requested enough for two 7" lcds

    dbef d400 45
    bef II 0 degree
    ESR
    ARMR-200

    This is what they recommended for automotive applications

  3. #3
    Constant Bitrate Gibson99's Avatar
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    Is anyone still doing this mod? i just tried to price it on digikey... OUCH!

    dbef d400 45 is 112 per 17x17 sheet
    esr is 34 per 11x11 sheet
    bef ii (or iii) 90/50 is about 29 per 11x11 sheet
    armr-200 is 30 for a 9x7 sheet

    all prices (rounded) from digikey as of 5-5-2010. total it up and that's more than i paid for my screen! granted, it's just a 7" lili (older one) but still!

    i wonder if 3m still does samples...
    Previous: CamryAmp 1.0 - 95 Camry SE V6 Coupe (sold)
    Current: CamryAmp 2.0 - 98 Camry CE V6 5spd (still bench-testing)

  4. #4
    Newbie Pegasus50's Avatar
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    We're discussing 3M Capacitant Touch Screens here. Perhaps you might find this interesting. Until I looked at this thread I was considering just replacing the Touch Screen portion of a cheap LCD. Now I'm beginning to think that it may be possible to replace other elements of the screen as well.

  5. #5
    Constant Bitrate Gibson99's Avatar
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    if i'm not mistaken, this thread isn't talking about replacing the TS, but the other elements you're talking about. specifically to increase sunlight visibility. two completely different subjects.
    Previous: CamryAmp 1.0 - 95 Camry SE V6 Coupe (sold)
    Current: CamryAmp 2.0 - 98 Camry CE V6 5spd (still bench-testing)

  6. #6
    Newbie Pegasus50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gibson99 View Post
    if i'm not mistaken, this thread isn't talking about replacing the TS, but the other elements you're talking about. specifically to increase sunlight visibility. two completely different subjects.
    Yes...yes they are. I saw a connection and wanted you to be aware of the thread. As I stated I'm interested in these enhancements myself. I'll read more carefully in the future.

  7. #7
    FLAC
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    Is it the bonded transreflector that makes a screen truly sunlight readable? In my EBY701, I took apart the LCD assembly to do the 3M upgrade but to my surprise, it looks like there are already 3M films present. I replaced the films anyways (just incase they werent actual 3M) and didnt notice any improvement in sunlight.

  8. #8
    Vendor - Qube colin's Avatar
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    The optical bonding makes a HUGE difference. I started this thread a while back and since then I decided to just buy an optically bonded (not "sunlight readable", be careful) screen.

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