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Thread: is there ever going to be a fe

  1. #1
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    is there ever going to be a fe

    I actuallly wanted to let off some steam as too sayimg . will there ever be a decent front end for mac that works . amp 2 is not touch friendly and ice keeps crashimg all the while i cant download q car for my mac

  2. #2
    Mod - all of it. SapporoGuy's Avatar
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    ummm, I asked months ago if people would like to see amp continue on ... nobody replied

    I guess they were hoping that bluehawk would provide their solution for the ipad/mac ...

    I keep playing with the idea of updating amp or creating my own but I don't own a mini to try out the in car experience. I guess I could use my macbook pro but that is not what I was intending.

    I just downloaded the latest xcode and I have been looking in things since I am very active on the web FE thread.

    I also keep asking myself if the ipad is a better solution to a mini ....

    Are you on intel or G4?

  3. #3
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    RevFE worked for Mac, but died for a lack of interest. There aren't enough Mac users for a Mac only frontend to thrive, and there isn't enough room in the market for new frontends to take hold very easily.
    "stop with the REINSTALLS, what do you think we got some lame-o installer!!!" - mitchjs
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  4. #4
    Mod - all of it. SapporoGuy's Avatar
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    I do agree with the not enough mac users.
    However, for a "pure" mac FE, I don't know of one that is active although
    AMP does work.

    On the windows side it's starting to look like OM, CF and RR. I guess that is because new users are looking at the activeness of the community.

    @ revFe
    To be honest I never tried your code, I must have missed it when I joined. Sorry dude!

  5. #5
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    I'm thinking OM is going to be the one for mac.. granted like linux, it's not exactly too useable at present. But it's definitely getting there and those guys are definitely high in the dedicated space.
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  6. #6
    Mod - all of it. SapporoGuy's Avatar
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    I have thought the same about OM but to be honest I'm not too sure about mono and it's ability to provide the "experience" that most people will be looking for.

    I have always been a fringe user of wintel because of that "experience" reason.

    I can relate to macs better but I did choose a wintel box for my carpc because I knew I'd enjoy the toys that the wintel world offers. However, no matter how much I like CF, there are always minor things that I miss.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by SapporoGuy View Post
    I have thought the same about OM but to be honest I'm not too sure about mono and it's ability to provide the "experience" that most people will be looking for.

    I have always been a fringe user of wintel because of that "experience" reason.

    I can relate to macs better but I did choose a wintel box for my carpc because I knew I'd enjoy the toys that the wintel world offers. However, no matter how much I like CF, there are always minor things that I miss.
    Well mono is just a wrapper.....we use the same system level APIs that native code would use on OSX...so I don't think mono is the limiting factor. It's just difficult to design a fe thats standard across all platforms but also fits a "different" user experience on one of them. At the moment, osx support for om is on hold due to a lack of interest both from users and developers.

  8. #8
    Mod - all of it. SapporoGuy's Avatar
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    @ Lack of interest and developers
    This is definitely a problem. However, this could be due to several things such as the mac vs wintel user share, lack of publicity (as in: mac is a viable carpc platform), mac developers are busy working on iphone/ipad development.

    @api
    I'm not real coder so I can not personally comment on whether mono provides the same level of access as say xcode. I still need to look at mono to see how it integrates with OSX. I'm just not how sure your statement of that it uses the same API. Accessing it yes I can agree. More than likely the performance should be nearly the same as a xcode product.

    @ experience
    The GUI is not really experience that I'm referring to. That is just a theme.

    It's more of a UI thing.
    Office's mac theme is close but it still is a Windows experience. CF is pretty good but it still feels like a wintel product, buttons don't follow the pattern throughout the software. The point here would be how the underlaying layer (the non-graphical) interacts with the user. I thought that meego looked cool until I tried it's menu system. Too many clicks and still difficult to navigate,

    AMP although a mac based software is different in its own way.

    I used the word "experience" because it's really hard to explain. IF it was easy to explain or understand Apple would have been gone away years ago. So, Yes, I agree. Designing a GUI that the public will accept is very difficult and takes time or at least a vision that many people can accept.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by SapporoGuy View Post
    @ Lack of interest and developers
    This is definitely a problem. However, this could be due to several things such as the mac vs wintel user share, lack of publicity (as in: mac is a viable carpc platform), mac developers are busy working on iphone/ipad development.
    Very few users want to spend more money to be limited to a certain set of hardware. While the number of ipad users is pretty high, I could probably count the number of osx users on one hand and that certainly is not worth significant development time. I doubt that bluehawk (whos claim to fame is the iHorn app) are really going to change the carcomputing userbase-so its really just up to if theres a talented osx dev that really wants to put the work in.

    Quote Originally Posted by SapporoGuy View Post
    @api
    I'm not real coder so I can not personally comment on whether mono provides the same level of access as say xcode. I still need to look at mono to see how it integrates with OSX. I'm just not how sure your statement of that it uses the same API. Accessing it yes I can agree. More than likely the performance should be nearly the same as a xcode product.
    asking if mono has access to osx is like asking if c++ has access to windows. Its just a development tool, how integrated you are into the host OS is really only limited by how much time you want to spend coding.

    Quote Originally Posted by SapporoGuy View Post
    @ experience
    The GUI is not really experience that I'm referring to. That is just a theme.

    It's more of a UI thing.
    Office's mac theme is close but it still is a Windows experience. CF is pretty good but it still feels like a wintel product, buttons don't follow the pattern throughout the software. The point here would be how the underlaying layer (the non-graphical) interacts with the user. I thought that meego looked cool until I tried it's menu system. Too many clicks and still difficult to navigate,

    AMP although a mac based software is different in its own way.

    I used the word "experience" because it's really hard to explain. IF it was easy to explain or understand Apple would have been gone away years ago. So, Yes, I agree. Designing a GUI that the public will accept is very difficult and takes time or at least a vision that many people can accept.
    I thought I was following you until about halfway through. Everything the user interacts with is the graphical layer...so im confused as to how the underlaying non-graphical layer interacts with the user.
    If its just a matter of GUI design, then its not really an issue of coding for OSX but just designing a skin that feels more natural to OSX users.

  10. #10
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    Smaller user base, no Mac devs interested enough to hang around and do it. Also, NO NAV. Most people who run Macs end up running nav via Fusion or Parallels at which point you might as well go ahead and run a Windows FE.

    I have and do run a Mac Mini in my car. At first for the novelty, and later because it's a really good hardware package and runs nearly any operating system. That's a niche set of a niche set of users.

    If you have a good FE, there's no need for the Mac experience aside from the ease of use when configuring the underpinnings. I can count on one hand the number of times I've had major issues with setting up the Mac, and OTOH there are days of my life I'd like back from other OS's. Regardless, a well configured Windows system is reliable and stable in the car and the community is much bigger. It's just a fact.
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