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Thread: Win7 32bit or 64bit?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by riahc3 View Post
    Um what? Your question makes no sense.

    When you are running a 64-bit kernel, you are running a 64-bit kernel. Everything is 64-bit BUT the instruction set for 32-bit is still there. Thats the difference between the AMD64/Intel 64 and the Itanium platform which only supports 64-bit instructions.

    A 32-bit program has NO 64-bit instructions just like a 64-bit program has (if it has a good developer) NO 32-bit instructions.

    Im hearing alot of "emulation" talk in this thread which is (99%) nonexistent because the 32-bit instruction set exists in the processor at hardward level, not at software. I say 99% because like I stated above, ****ty developers are using emulated methods so their 64-bit program is not truely 64-bit (saves time which saves money) which thus slows down certain applications (games suffer this, it is getting alot better though)

    Now in the carputer world (and also in the consumer world) I would (note that this is a personal opinion of mine and some may or may not agree with it) personally recommened not installing a 64-bit OS. Reasons have be given above such as problems with driver/plugins, memory overhead, etc but the number one reason is development; Until Microsoft, the top OS developer, releases a 64-bit only OS, developers WILL NOT jump to making 64-bit applications. This is why me and others are hoping that the next Windows is 64-bit only compatible so developers have to jump ship because, like chunkyks said, alot of Windows users are (even if they dont know it) using a 64-bit version of Windows (Vista or 7) and this will also make users have to use 64-bit OSs
    if your going to correct someone at least be right the question was does a 64bit processor execute 32bit code any faster and the answer is not really, it depends on the instruction. Some execute in parallel on 64bit others just have a larger pipeline to go through.
    Again, your incorrect about emulation, cpu architectures can absolutely be emulated (how do you think smartphone apps are tested)... although you will never find this done in standalone programs (not sure what gave you the idea that games do this).
    Windows server architecture is already 64bit and no doubt future versions of windows will be 64bit only but this has absolutely nothing to do with why 64bit adoption has been slow.

    Quote Originally Posted by Curiosity View Post
    WoW64 emulates a 32 bit environment using the memory manager, not the full instruction set. Only the memory addressing instructions. Sorry if I caused any confusion.

    There's 64 bit memory addressing, 64 bit registers, 64 bit bus between CPU and memory. PICe-x4 is 64, but most of the glue chips still need some work, so there are still some 32 bit bottlenecks.

    So the main advantage is more memory. We already use 64 bit numbers on 32, just like 16 on 8-bit. Now it's little faster for the CPU to do it's thing internally on math rarely used by average software.

    Average binaries are double the size, so it takes double the memory and that means double the addressing of the binary per/second so to speak, but the bus is doubled so it's not a big deal. 64 bit means we probably need 50% more RAM is what it comes down to, at least for now. A few extra watts too.

    So accessing large amounts of data on WoW64 is noticably slower and a 64 bit binary is faster.

    32 is slower on 64 than it would be on 32.
    64 won't run on 32. No emulation.
    Neither 32 or 64 kernel space binaries will run on the wrong platform. Below emulation level.
    Running just one 32 bit app on 64 means context switching or possibly allocating a whole core of a multi-core CPU. But if it's not a CPU intensive app, nobody will notice it much.
    wow64 really isn't noticeably slower...only transitioning into and out of wow64 takes a microsecond..... after that their just using different memory managers, neither is faster/slower.

  2. #22
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    Phew, I got worried!
    I meant "noob" as in "me not up to date".
    I was surprised I was that misunderstood.

    But yeah - I soon figured.
    Geez - I remember "128-bit" emulations on 8-bit platforms.

    For riahc3, I did mean "running 32 bit code on a 64-bit CPU" (whether the 32b set is hardware or not).


    For now I'll take Curiosity's "32 is slower on 64 than it would be on 32" as my benchmark - realising that that will change.
    Afterall, emulating the old Z80 or HCs or 286s etc were once slower than their home platform, but I somehow doubt that is still true (3GHz vs 20MHz etc? That's room for 150 cycles per emulation element; minimum.).

    Oh dear - know I'm thinking of how data comms were run '386 equivalents a few years back... but they were UNIX (and called Sparc). But let's no go there.


    Thanks for the understanding. Sorry for any confusion.

  3. #23
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    I think the point he is trying to make is 32bit applications operate much slower under a 64bit version of Windows operating system than under a 32bit one if they use a lot of CPU calculation such as video editing. But you would not notice much difference when using Internet Explorer 32bit vs 64bit under a 64bit OS.
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    All i know is I'm running win 7 64 bit, and before that I was using XP 32 bit. Now my bluetooth, gps, and wireless network adapter don't work. I found a fix for the network adapter but it was a painful process. It's mostly my fault for not researching the 64 bit version, but now that I have it I wish I didn't. I shouldn't have all these problem with it but I do, so I really want to go back to 32 bit. My vote is for that in car pc for the time being.

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    just to ad another good point about W7 is hibernation and true SSD support

    i've managed to get everything working on a 64Bit platform in terms of my hardware and drivers, so i dont see this as a bad thing when i run a quad core, happy to lend one core to do 32/64 conversions

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    I just found out about gpsgate, and now my gps reciever works! Also found a guy who fixed my linsys USB wireless network adapter. Only problem I can't fix it the bluetooth issue. I'm running Centrafuse and it says bluetooth device not found, yet windows 7 recognizes it, BUT windows 7 bluetooth software doesn't see my phone and vise-versa.

    If I could just fix that now... shame I just ordered the 32 bit version the day before i fixed the gps problem.... figures.

    I'm also running an SSD drive. I love how fast it resumes. Its near instant from sleep and 10 seconds from hibernate

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    I just want to add, your operating system uses encryption and compression a lot. There is a slight edge when using a 64bit OS.

    As for the larger memory footprint, this wouldn't be a huge issue if most people weren't running a big fat bulky operating system .

    That said, MeeGo and LinuxICE are 32bit. There's not enough embedded hardware that is 64bit to justify 64bit builds. Also running more than 4gigs in your car is excessive at best and silly otherwise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tripzero View Post
    I just want to add, your operating system uses encryption and compression a lot. There is a slight edge when using a 64bit OS.

    As for the larger memory footprint, this wouldn't be a huge issue if most people weren't running a big fat bulky operating system .

    That said, MeeGo and LinuxICE are 32bit. There's not enough embedded hardware that is 64bit to justify 64bit builds. Also running more than 4gigs in your car is excessive at best and silly otherwise.
    HEYYYYYYYYYYY..... it depends on the install! I need all 4GB of RAM on both systems.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    HEYYYYYYYYYYY..... it depends on the install! I need all 4GB of RAM on both systems.
    yes, but you're doing it wrong.

    note: wrong as it may be, it's probably the only available solution right now no?
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kosti View Post
    i've managed to get everything working on a 64Bit platform in terms of my hardware and drivers, so i dont see this as a bad thing when i run a quad core, happy to lend one core to do 32/64 conversions
    You do realize thats not at all how it works... 32/64bit transitions effect the entire CPU which can cause a significant bottleneck when mixing 32 and 64 bit code.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1996C1500 View Post
    I'm also running an SSD drive. I love how fast it resumes. Its near instant from sleep and 10 seconds from hibernate
    Just an FYI-sleep/suspend has nothing to do with drive performance. 10s is about average for a higher end 7200rpm drive hibernating-see the startup times thread for more details.

    Quote Originally Posted by tripzero View Post
    I just want to add, your operating system uses encryption and compression a lot. There is a slight edge when using a 64bit OS.

    As for the larger memory footprint, this wouldn't be a huge issue if most people weren't running a big fat bulky operating system .

    That said, MeeGo and LinuxICE are 32bit. There's not enough embedded hardware that is 64bit to justify 64bit builds. Also running more than 4gigs in your car is excessive at best and silly otherwise.
    OS footprint has nothing to do with application size and load times... lets keep real facts and penguin facts separate please
    I also can't say I know of anyone running an encrypted file system in a carPC so thats kind of a moot point.
    Quote Originally Posted by HiJackZX1 View Post
    HEYYYYYYYYYYY..... it depends on the install! I need all 4GB of RAM on both systems.
    really? based on what? I'll bet you don't use more then 60% of that when your system is actually done

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