Thread: opus vs inverter

Modified sine is not exactly a bunch of square waves made close to a sign. A better description is a jagged sine wave. Instead of being smooth, it is like stair steps up and down.

Modern PC power supplies have absolutely no problem what so ever with modified sine wave.

It is true that noise can be a problem with an inverter, but if you know what you are doing, and do a proper wiring job, it often is not an issue, or can be minimized to at extent where it is not noticible. There are some vehicles that are just plain noisy, and using a DC-DC PSU is the easist solution.

goosey2099, don't bother posting if you are going to use language like that, and don't spout crap without giving anything solid to back it up. We don't like flamers in these forums.

Recently a user in these forums posted who is slightly dissapointed in the Opus. Largely from reading posts about how it is the best, etc. he made the decision to purchase it. Now he's found it won't even power up his PC, which was only 1.3ghz. He had to underclock a Celeron 1.3GHz to power it! At least with an inverter he was able to run it at full speed! Plus he is having other problems, such as are know to happen with Opus 150w.

All I'm getting at is: KEEP PERSPECTIVE! Opus doesn't work for everyone. I'm not saying an inverter is the best, but IMHO, neither is OPUS.

KyferEz

Originally Posted by joshthepilot

goosey says to kyferez in a calm but curious manner: "Are you my daddy?"

Well let’s see I was reading this forum for a long time before I even thought about joining. I have had 2 inverters in the cars that I have owned and they were horrible!!!. All I had was engine noise. I'm also a fanatic when it comes to have everything running perfect so when I did my research I decided to fork over $200+ and skip the headache of tweaking my system by adding all sorts of filters. Inverters are Horrible; they are intended for portable TV’s that can only show you channel 11 (if available in your area). For a computer power situation you really should get something that is build for that purpose. When I put my system together last week, for the first time since I’ve been working with cars I didn't have the slightest fear that something might not work. I did my research, I tried reading as much as possible and I built a system that can do absolutely everything that I can hope for.

So when you say that i'm not giving something solid to back it up I say whats the point when it comes to this subject, This has been posted over a thousand times.

Originally Posted by KyferEz

I have much more flexibility than any Opus user. I have a faster PC than most with an Opus, and it doesn't lock up from lack of power like those running too much off an Opus.

Oh ya? And what are your carputer specs? How do you have more flexability than I do?

Originally Posted by KyferEz

Recently a user in these forums posted who is slightly dissapointed in the Opus. Largely from reading posts about how it is the best, etc. he made the decision to purchase it. Now he's found it won't even power up his PC, which was only 1.3ghz. He had to underclock a Celeron 1.3GHz to power it! At least with an inverter he was able to run it at full speed! Plus he is having other problems, such as are know to happen with Opus 150w.

You honestly believe that his 1.3GHz was overpowering it?

I have had 2 inverters in the cars that I have owned and they were horrible!!!. All I had was engine noise. I'm also a fanatic when it comes to have everything running perfect...

So, since you are such a fanatic, what did you do to try and solve the noise problem? Noise is simply some sort of ground loop, which may be due to a poor wiring job, insufficient grounds, a noisy ground location, a bad connection, etc. Did you trace the noise down and see how the ground loop was forming, or did you try changing ground locations, larger gauge wire, and grounding the PC case? Did you try a ground loop isolator or an ac isolation transformer? You mentioned skipping the nosie filters, but you don't need them if you stop the ground loop.

Were you attempting to use your head unit along with the PC and inverter? If so, the ground on your head unit probably had a lot to do with all the extra noise. I threw away my head unit when I installed the PC; all my speakers are powered from external amplifiers, so I didn't need it, and there aren't any decent DJs on radio anyway, and I can't stand commercials or talk radio, so I didn't want it .

Just so others aren't mislead, inverter are not _just_ designed for portable tvs.

So when you say that i'm not giving something solid to back it up I say whats the point when it comes to this subject, This has been posted over a thousand times.

Well, I was asking for YOUR reasons, not everyone elses. That way it doesn't look like just another flame. Thanks for giving them.

Oh ya? And what are your carputer specs? How do you have more flexability than I do?

AMD XP 3000+
512MB DDR
12.1" LCD
iGesture mini keyboard/touchpad
USB GPS
D-Link USB 802.11g 108Mbps
300watt ATX psu
SB Live sound
CDRW
DVD
Coleman 800watt RMS inverter
Our Pro Power Controller, v2.4
tank ez v1.0

I have more flexibility than you likely just because of our Power Controller. Have you looked at our Power Controllers? They offer so many features you cannot duplicate with an Opus. What is your CPU? If your running a setup like mine on Opus, you either underclocked it, have 2 Opus' running in parallel, or are killing your Opus and may have a PC that locks up due to under-powering issues. And I can add much more to my CarPC without worrying about power problems. I can also power nearly anything off the inverter I want. It has so much extra power available I can run a 2nd PC and still have extra power (If I decided to do a dual carpc install) The only thing I don't have is as much run time with the car off - but for me, that isn't an issue as I rarely use the PC when the car isn't running. And just so you know, I never had noise problems; not even the first day I installed the inverter. But I used 4 gauge wire and ground locations I knew were not noisy.

You honestly believe that his 1.3GHz was overpowering it?

Here is the post, I just restated what he said. Opus 150W - 1 week later impressions and questions

KyferEz

Originally Posted by KyferEz

So, since you are such a fanatic, what did you do to try and solve the noise problem? Noise is simply some sort of ground loop, which may be due to a poor wiring job, insufficient grounds, a noisy ground location, a bad connection, etc. Did you trace the noise down and see how the ground loop was forming, or did you try changing ground locations, larger gauge wire, and grounding the PC case? Did you try a ground loop isolator or an ac isolation transformer? You mentioned skipping the nosie filters, but you don't need them if you stop the ground loop.

Were you attempting to use your head unit along with the PC and inverter? If so, the ground on your head unit probably had a lot to do with all the extra noise. I threw away my head unit when I installed the PC; all my speakers are powered from external amplifiers, so I didn't need it, and there aren't any decent DJs on radio anyway, and I can't stand commercials or talk radio, so I didn't want it .

Just so others aren't mislead, inverter are not _just_ designed for portable tvs.


Well, I was asking for YOUR reasons, not everyone elses. That way it doesn't look like just another flame. Thanks for giving them.


AMD XP 3000+
512MB DDR
12.1" LCD
iGesture mini keyboard/touchpad
USB GPS
D-Link USB 802.11g 108Mbps
300watt ATX psu
SB Live sound
CDRW
DVD
Coleman 800watt RMS inverter
Our Pro Power Controller, v2.4
tank ez v1.0

I have more flexibility than you likely just because of our Power Controller. Have you looked at our Power Controllers? They offer so many features you cannot duplicate with an Opus. What is your CPU? If your running a setup like mine on Opus, you either underclocked it, have 2 Opus' running in parallel, or are killing your Opus and may have a PC that locks up due to under-powering issues. And I can add much more to my CarPC without worrying about power problems. I can also power nearly anything off the inverter I want. It has so much extra power available I can run a 2nd PC and still have extra power (If I decided to do a dual carpc install) The only thing I don't have is as much run time with the car off - but for me, that isn't an issue as I rarely use the PC when the car isn't running. And just so you know, I never had noise problems; not even the first day I installed the inverter. But I used 4 gauge wire and ground locations I knew were not noisy.


Here is the post, I just restated what he said. Opus 150W - 1 week later impressions and questions

KyferEz

My sig. has my setup except for my USB devices and the Opus handles it just fine without any lockups. The Opus does every single thing I want it to do. I have never had to worry about power problems and I don't plan on adding anything else that would affect my power consumption any time soon.

Originally Posted by xBrady

My sig. has my setup except for my USB devices and the Opus handles it just fine without any lockups. The Opus does every single thing I want it to do. I have never had to worry about power problems and I don't plan on adding anything else that would affect my power consumption any time soon.

The Opus doesn't do everything that everyone else wants it to. And this is about others, not just you.

So the Opus works fine being overloaded for now. Tell me in 6 months to a year if it is still stable. I will be surprised if it is. The guy I originally began designing our Power Controllers for (name is Shaun and has no current affiliation with TheCarPCStore other than receiving free upgrades since it was designed with some of his ideas) used to use the Opus 150. He had a P4 3GHz. It worked fine for some time. However, after several months (I think it was 4 or 5 months; it was less than a year, but I'm not exactly sure how long it was), he began having trouble with it locking up, blue screens, then it finally died.

He has gone inverter now, uses our current Power Controller, and never looked back. He never had problems with noise from the inverter either - but he did it the smart way and when he had a head unit used a digital input so ground loop noise couldn't pass into the sound system. He recently got rid of his head unit altogether.

IMHO, people are wasting money if they overdrive the Opus to power a setup like yours, mine, or Shaun's. It's going to eventually die. It's possible it won't, but if it doesn't, you may have gotten lucky and gotten one with components that exceeded the manufacturer specs. You shouldn't expect others to have the same results.

Edit: This was to goosey2099; I forgot I was talking to 2 differnet people and goosey2099 hasn't even responded yet... but I am leaving it here anyway:
And you didn't answer any of my questions. Does that mean you didn't do anything siginificant to resolve the ground loops causing your noise before ditching the inverter? And did you use your head unit along with the PC without providing a better ground to the head unit and PC case? If you didn't try to resolve the gound loop (and not just try to filter the resulting noise, which is fixing the symptom, not the problem) with some real desire and drive to do so, you shouldn't say that using an inverter is crap and recommend everyone default to the Opus.

There is no reason that others shouldn't use the cheaper, more flexible method. Sure, they _may_ have to spend some time finding the ground loop if they end up having one. But then again, they may not. And if not, it is a simple, cheap, versatile solution.

KyferEz

Originally Posted by KyferEz

For now it does. Tell me in 6 months to a year if it is still stable. I will be surprised if it is. The guy I originally began designing our Power Controllers for (name is Shaun and has no current affiliation with TheCarPCStore other than receiving free upgrades since it was designed with some of his ideas) used to use the Opus 150. He had a P4 3GHz. It worked fine for some time. However, after several months (I think it was 4 or 5 months; it was less than a year, but I'm not exactly sure how long it was), he began having trouble with it locking up, blue screens, then it finally died.

He has gone inverter now, uses our current Power Controller, and never looked back. He never had problems with noise from the inverter either - but he did it the smart way and when he had a head unit used a digital input so ground loop noise couldn't pass into the sound system. He recently got rid of his head unit altogether.

IMHO, you are wasting money if you overdrive the Opus to power a setup like yours, mine, or Shaun's. It's going to eventually die. It's possible it won't, but if it doesn't, you may have gotten lucky and got one with components that exceeded the manufacturer specs and shouldn't expect others to have the same results.

I have had this exact carputer for 8 months without any sign of a problem. Just because someones Opus died after 4-5 months doesn't mean that Opuses in general will all die with such a load for that amount of time. Plenty of Inverters have died in much less time around here.

Originally Posted by KyferEz

And you didn't answer any of my questions. Does that mean you didn't do anything siginificant to resolve the ground loops causing your noise before ditching the inverter?

KyferEz

I assume this was directed to someone else.

Originally Posted by goosey2099

**** inverter!! OPUS is the only way to go!

This is just retarded. My inverter works like an opus. Of course I have relays and stuff to help, but I feel that those with an Opus took the expensive/easy way out, whereas I probably have maybe $30 in my power solution.

But, I'll agree with Brady, Opus will probably last longer, I think my inverter is on it's last leg. Pretty good for almost 5 years.

Edit: Those questions were directed to goosey2099. Also, you need to re-read my last one, I added a bunch of data.

And just because your Opus is surviving doesn't mean others will. They are rated at 150 watts, you are overdriving it, and I don't think you will replace someone's Opus who imitates your setup, will you? If not, don't advise others to overdrive their Opus.

There are a lot of very cheaply made inverters. Those that die prematurely are likely made by a company I will not mention here (but are sold at walmart), or are being overdriven. I use and recommend Coleman inverters. There are many who have good experiences with them here.

Tidder, his Opus won't last 5 years if he keeps overdriving it. It prolly will last a long long time if not being overdriven. The components in the Opus are quality, and that is the only reason it can stand being overdriven for any time at all.

KyferEz