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Thread: Discussion of Standardization in RoadRunner skins, plugins, addons and whatever else

  1. #121
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    i doubt people would argee with you, only you find them that way, and thats a attitude\


    No one was PUTTING any standards in, only suggestions, and you should read it, and look at what standards are in play (very little) again guidelines

    if you have a problem, you can go back play with your CF front end
    if you want to be involved in plugin standards(guidelines) that is welcome too
    it just has to be organized and go though me/blue/guino
    mostly me, since i wrote/rewrote all the plugin management code in rr now
    and im open to ANY suggestions
    -Thanks
    Mitch
    www.rush2112.net

    "Did you test it in carwings??"

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  2. #122
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    Enforcer's Avatar
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    I think you'll find a lot of people agree with me on your attitude.

    Anyway.

    The standards were only suggestions, yes, because there was/is no way of making them concrete, but we were making an effort to get them standardised, which you totally ignored without a by your leave.

    I have a problem with a lot of things you are doing, I also agree with a lot you are trying to do, just don't like some of the ways in which you are doing it.

    I have been using RideRunner/RoadRunner/ReMediaCar since it's inception and you are not going to run me off. And I will keep putting forth my opinion so get used to it.

    But I will also look at other frontends to develop for and if I think one FrontEnd can learn from the other I will mention. And those goes either way. RR-->CF or CF-->RR

    And you are not open to ANY suggestions, the first thing you do when something is suggested is shoot it down.

    Do I want to be involved in Plugin Standards, what the hell do you think I was trying to do before you came along?


    However it's two ways, you need to consult the plugin developers (as I keep saying) to see what they think of new ideas and how they are going to be implimented BEFORE you implement them, then there is room for manouvre on both sides.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by mitchjs View Post
    yes, SKINS are in the PROFILE storage, since they are USER modded files
    and also have some .inis involed

    there is NO 100% way to enforce (hehe) any standard due to VB6 legacy language
    with no interfaces

    RULE #1 is so simple, NO WRITEABLE DATA belongs in the "PROGRAM FILES" directory!

    mydocuments is perfectly allowed by Microsoft standards to save program data
    this allows for simplified backup too...
    just install visual studio 2005/2008 and take a look what microsoft puts there!

    as for standards, these are all GUIDELINES, that should be followed
    if you write a plugin and save data in program files, dont expect it to work on win7 or vista, it will get virtualized and written in a differnt location, which is OK in some cases
    Quote Originally Posted by mitchjs View Post
    and this isnt BULL, im still waiting for someone to write up a document on plugins... documentation leads to guidelines for standards
    Quote Originally Posted by mitchjs View Post
    i doubt people would argee with you, only you find them that way, and thats a attitude\


    No one was PUTTING any standards in, only suggestions, and you should read it, and look at what standards are in play (very little) again guidelines

    if you have a problem, you can go back play with your CF front end
    if you want to be involved in plugin standards(guidelines) that is welcome too
    it just has to be organized and go though me/blue/guino
    mostly me, since i wrote/rewrote all the plugin management code in rr now
    and im open to ANY suggestions

    Then I suggest we have a discussion about standards before they become standards. Unless of course the 3 of you are going to be the only ones writing plugins. Seriously though, there's no reason for the back and forth stuff here. Save it for PM. I get the impression that Enforcer like alot of us feel like maybe RR is jumping the shark a bit. Used to be ALL about user feedback and now users AND developers are a bit left out in the cold about whats going on. I mean you pretty much showed how things are different mitch when you mentioned internal file management and how the only people that utilize it are the people that put it in. Aside from the 1 line description of the gist of what it is.. how is anyone supposed to know what the heck it is and how to make use of it. Developers AND users are gonna be more and more reluctant to go back and change the way we've always done things if there's no clear reason to do so.
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  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enforcer View Post
    I think you'll find a lot of people agree with me on your attitude.

    Anyway.

    The standards were only suggestions, yes, because there was/is no way of making them concrete, but we were making an effort to get them standardised, which you totally ignored without a by your leave.

    I have a problem with a lot of things you are doing, I also agree with a lot you are trying to do, just don't like some of the ways in which you are doing it.

    I have been using RideRunner/RoadRunner/ReMediaCar since it's inception and you are not going to run me off. And I will keep putting forth my opinion so get used to it.

    But I will also look at other frontends to develop for and if I think one FrontEnd can learn from the other I will mention. And those goes either way. RR-->CF or CF-->RR

    And you are not open to ANY suggestions, the first thing you do when something is suggested is shoot it down.

    Do I want to be involved in Plugin Standards, what the hell do you think I was trying to do before you came along?


    However it's two ways, you need to consult the plugin developers (as I keep saying) to see what they think of new ideas and how they are going to be implimented BEFORE you implement them, then there is room for manouvre on both sides.

    where the HELL am i shooting down suggestions??

    what am i doing SPECIFICLY that you have a problem with?

    the ONLY thing im doing is making RR BETTER!!!

    AND NO ONE WHO USES IT (BESIDES U) will DISPUTE THAT!
    -Thanks
    Mitch
    www.rush2112.net

    "Did you test it in carwings??"

    Sun, Come shine my way
    May healing waters bury all my pain
    Wind, Carry me home
    The fabric of reality is tearing apart
    The piece of me that died
    Will return To live again

  5. #125
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    Sonic, the INTERNAL FILE MANAGER, IS NOT IN PLAY
    ITS RESERVED at this point, because it opens a door, that i dont feel is ready to be opened

    its HOW RR should have been done DAY 1, but since it wasnt, its a change
    and RR is managing files RIGHT NOW, but as it always did
    -Thanks
    Mitch
    www.rush2112.net

    "Did you test it in carwings??"

    Sun, Come shine my way
    May healing waters bury all my pain
    Wind, Carry me home
    The fabric of reality is tearing apart
    The piece of me that died
    Will return To live again

  6. #126
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    Also there are no standards!!!!!
    Only guidelines
    nothing can be inforced
    -Thanks
    Mitch
    www.rush2112.net

    "Did you test it in carwings??"

    Sun, Come shine my way
    May healing waters bury all my pain
    Wind, Carry me home
    The fabric of reality is tearing apart
    The piece of me that died
    Will return To live again

  7. #127
    Low Bitrate TxAxZxZ's Avatar
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    Will these "standards" enable the use of EWF where I can put my .ini files into a writeable directory and have RR installed within the EWF? Currently I have RR installed in a writeable directory as a whole, along with Winamp and iGuidance, just so I can save music being played/recent addresses/POI's upon shutdown.
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  8. #128
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    txaxzxa, HORM has already been addressed and is fully working
    RR does not need to be in a writeable directory
    all .inis are preserved for resume

    there is a thread on HORM and the 4/1 build

    now for POIs and addresses thats a iguidance issue, RR wont manage them


    are u using HORM? since even having a writeable dir, will be corrupted when hibernation caches that file


    for sure profile mode would be the way to go here
    -Thanks
    Mitch
    www.rush2112.net

    "Did you test it in carwings??"

    Sun, Come shine my way
    May healing waters bury all my pain
    Wind, Carry me home
    The fabric of reality is tearing apart
    The piece of me that died
    Will return To live again

  9. #129
    The Last Good Gremlin GizmoQ's Avatar
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    Wait a minute. My biggest pet peeve with RR right now is a perfect example of all of us being steamrolled: ACTIVESOURCEID.

    When I first brought this up I thought Guino would establish the order akin to what gets used most, i.e., MP3 audio would be first, Video or FM would be next, then XM, then Sirius. Just because the "user-base" follows along these lines as does most skin development.

    NO DAMN BODY WAS CONSULTED ABOUT THE ORDERING AND ANYONE MENTION CHANGING IT GOT SQUASHED!

    This is a prime reason Chuck and I keep plastering the forum with RRCode to show how to setup your own AudioSource variables. Hell I've seen three or four mentions about adding custom sources to your ACTIVESOURCEID, but how is not explained anywhere - that's a lot of help!

    I'm the one who started this thread, so I know there is no such thing as forcing standardization in RR, but the goal was getting consensus from the author and major contributors, then all of a sudden the development "team" came along and users/programmers/skinners "you get what you get" attitude was overwhelming. This thread could have been your outlet to inform the community of what you have planned what's in work, how to streamline different aspects of this powerful front-end, but it was ignored, hell you guys didn't even bother to mention here about the name change or directory change or the FMpresets change or any other changes the rest of the world have no idea that you've done until its crammed down our throats.

    /rant mode off
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  10. #130
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    i did ACTIVESOURCEID, cause i discovered that RR is NOT source based, but SKIN based... things happen based on skin file names, not on source...

    ACTIVESOURCEID was new, and didnt need to follow any specific order, as long as it gave you which source was playing, and it tryies its best to do that
    -Thanks
    Mitch
    www.rush2112.net

    "Did you test it in carwings??"

    Sun, Come shine my way
    May healing waters bury all my pain
    Wind, Carry me home
    The fabric of reality is tearing apart
    The piece of me that died
    Will return To live again

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