Discussion of Standardization in RoadRunner skins, plugins, addons and whatever else

**Sonicxtacy02** · 10-16-2008, 10:28 AM

Originally Posted by Enforcer

Been wanting to use that smiley for a while.

ps, sometimes it is best not to be in a list. (any way it was late and I added the TBC so I could add others later

Right lets seperate plugins from essentials first.

GDIplus.dll is and essential and should not be considered a plugin, thus it should be in the root of Road Runner.

Winamp.dll (and the other player dll which I can't think of) is again probably a required dll rather than a plugin one and again should be in the root.

MP3Art.dll not sure about this one, but this is probably a plugin and therefore should be in <RRpath>\plugins\MP3art\ (note not the root of the plugins folder, nothing should be in the root, except maybe documentation to help developers)

as far as I know the above mentioned plugins do not need to have folders in the root of RR, I know for sure RRTrafficCams, RRGas and RRPetrol don't.

See I don't get this need for the pluginpath to be known to RR and/or the plugins.

All a plugin has to do is exists in it's own little subfolder (or in fact anyway on the PC even) of the plugins folder and know where Road Runner is. It knows where it is so it doesn't have to look to the RR.ini to find out where it should be.

Anything else it needs to know is going to be relative to where it is or where roadrunner is.

if a plugin needs to read another plugins ini file then there is something wrong, but again all the plugins are stored in their own subfolder off of a general plugins folder, the plugin can easily work out what the plugin folder is.

NB. MyPath = app.path is all you need in VB6 to know where you are, I'm sure AI has a similar command.

app.path displays RRs path in an extension plugin not the .dlls path in vb6. Least thats how it works in my version lol. in .net and other "newer" languages its easy to find but thats not all of my point. My point is just that if we're creating dedicated folders why not let the user identify them if they want. Its a matter of consistency, backgrounds have a var i can depend on, why not plugins too. That being said.. its hardly a strong argument from me. Both ways work.

**Valheru** · 10-16-2008, 10:36 AM

i have another question about the "plugins" ...

for example TEK3 has a "support" folder that contains AI scripts from various other authors - each one in it's own folder (albumviewer, locker etc). Going forward will these need to be treated as plugins and put in the plugins folder ... and if so - does that mean that all skins will need an installer, so that they put the stuff in the right place - or do we leave it to the mercy of the user to manually copy over the stuff to the plugins folder ?

and following on from that - how is it proposed we handle the situation where a plugin folder already exists but "my new skin" uses a slightly different setup of that plugin ... do I go and just overwrite whats there or create a second install of the plugin .. bringing us back to where we started ?

I'm not trying to be awkard here ... just trying to tease out all of the technical possabilities for this !

**Enforcer** · 10-16-2008, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by Sonicxtacy02

app.path displays RRs path in an extension plugin not the .dlls path in vb6. Least thats how it works in my version lol.

Well if it does then none of my plugins should work. Because I use app.path many times in RRGas, RRpetrol and RRTrafficCams and they all work.

Just added a quick debug line to RRpetrol and tested it, it printed out the path to RRPetrol just fine.

Originally Posted by Sonicxtacy02

Its a matter of consistency, backgrounds have a var i can depend on, why not plugins too. That being said.. its hardly a strong argument from me. Both ways work.

Because it is not needed.

It's like asking the man in Florida why he's wearing a parker coat and he replies because my brother is wearing one in nova scotia is wearing one.

You stick a variable like PluginsPath in rr.ini all it needs is one plugin to decide to change it and no other plugin that relies on that path will work.

**Enforcer** · 10-16-2008, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by Valheru

i have another question about the "plugins" ...

for example TEK3 has a "support" folder that contains AI scripts from various other authors - each one in it's own folder (albumviewer, locker etc). Going forward will these need to be treated as plugins and put in the plugins folder ... and if so - does that mean that all skins will need an installer, so that they put the stuff in the right place - or do we leave it to the mercy of the user to manually copy over the stuff to the plugins folder ?

Ideally the plugins should be handled by the upcoming plugin browser that Sonic is working on (no pressure fella), so skin should just be an extract to skins folder job.

Originally Posted by Valheru

and following on from that - how is it proposed we handle the situation where a plugin folder already exists but "my new skin" uses a slightly different setup of that plugin ... do I go and just overwrite whats there or create a second install of the plugin .. bringing us back to where we started ?

A good plugin should not have a situation where one skin uses it differently to another.

Anything that is different should be in the skin files and not files that are in the plugins folder.

**Valheru** · 10-16-2008, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Enforcer

A good plugin should not have a situation where one skin uses it differently to another.

...

Well yes and no .. for example. El Camino released the IE Radio plugin, but because of the way it displayed info (and because El kindly passed over this sources) the version in TEK3 is a different EXE than the one EL's supplied, but more importantly it uses different LABELS / VARIABLES .. so IE Radio.EXE that came with El-s skin will not display info correctly in TEK3 and vice versa ... this is also the case for 3 or 4 (of 11) other plugins in TEK3 skin.

How is this to be handled ... Do I re-release the updated IE Radio as a new version and overwrite the older version - meaning that someone elses skin will not work any more ?

**Blue ZX3** · 10-16-2008, 11:24 AM

Any script/app that is customized for that particular skin should really be stored in the skin folder's "scripts" (or whereever the skinner wants to place it) folder just like all the scripts that make DFX run. They are all custom to that skin an is why they are all inside that skin's folder.

**Blue ZX3** · 10-16-2008, 11:28 AM

Originally Posted by Enforcer

Originally Posted by Sonicxtacy02

app.path displays RRs path in an extension plugin not the .dlls path in vb6. Least thats how it works in my version lol.

Well if it does then none of my plugins should work. Because I use app.path many times in RRGas, RRpetrol and RRTrafficCams and they all work.
Just added a quick debug line to RRpetrol and tested it, it printed out the path to RRPetrol just fine.

Beat me to it. I think that sonic might also be confusing that with the work that he did when adding stuff to rr code a many moons ago...

**Valheru** · 10-16-2008, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by Blue ZX3

Any script/app that is customized for that particular skin should really be stored in the skin folder's "scripts" (or whereever the skinner wants to place it) folder just like all the scripts that make DFX run. They are all custom to that skin an is why they are all inside that skin's folder.

ok .. thanks that answers my question ...

**Blue ZX3** · 10-16-2008, 11:33 AM

Anyone's finger's hurting yet from typing..

On the Idea of the background being set to a color if no path is set or is incorrect, I mentioned this to guino probably like ~1.5 yrs ago in a PM as to alleviate the "why is rr only showing buttons when moused over" questions and he said it was a good idea and would add it to the code. I don't know if somewhere it got 86'd or what but it "should" still be there I believe he said it would default to black.

"Firstly the background issue ... instead of suggesting "that all skinners must use ..." how about having RR become a little more intelligent. As RR loads a skin let it check if the BACKGROUNDPATH is actually set in RR, and if it's not then have RR load a default BG colour to get the skin going."

This would also be easy to do at the skinners level when the skin is first ran as both my RRMedia demo skin and DFX do on first startup.

Originally Posted by Valheru

hell I don't even understand RRMEDIA, it's way too complex for in car use anyway.

IMO...and the old RR browser is overly outdated