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Thread: Song sort order problems, suddenly

  1. #1
    Constant Bitrate 01black_ac's Avatar
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    Song sort order problems, suddenly

    I know this has been discussed many times on the forum, and I've read all those threads, but this is very weird...

    I had all my music that I was putting together on my HT (home theater) machine in my living room. As I've been working on my skin design and setting up the software installation on my car pc, I've been using the music archive on the HT machine to listen to, add to playlists in RR, etc... Using the !SELECT+ command, all the files were always added in proper alphabetical order. (My directories are set up as:

    artist - album (so they sit alphanumerically)

    and within each folder the tracks are set up as:

    01 trackname.mp3
    02 trackname.mp3
    etc... (so they sit alphanumerically)

    This morning I put my carPC on the network and transferred approx 18Gb of music from the HT machine onto the carPC.

    Now, suddenly, whenever I use the same !SELECT+ command, the music is added completely out of order, in some cases in 100% reverse order (i.e. folders beginning with 'W' are added first and folders beginning with 'A' are added last...)

    I then changed my !SELECT+ button to:

    "!SELECT+||ACTIVATE;Playlist Editor||SENDKEY;^+3||RELOADLIST||GOTOFIRST",

    and it does re-sort the files into the proper alphabetical order, but the highlight/selection-bar skips down to the album which would have been the first one listed in the wrong order... i.e. if the directory contains albums which start with 'A' all the way down to 'W', and they show up as 'W' first, all the way down to 'A', then the playlist now gets re-sorted properly as 'A' down to 'W', but the first highlighted selection after the list is added is the 'W' album, so it's still showing up as the first album even after the re-sort. In other words, the selection bar which should start at the very first album in the list (A) now starts at the first track of the last album in the list (W)...

    The funny thing is that if I run a DOS Shell and do a DIR command on the music directory on the HT machine, the results come back as A down to W. If I do a DIR on the same directory on the new carPC copies of the music, they show up as W down to A, exactly as RR is now showing them to me. So something changed in the "Last written" time, or "Last Accessed" time of the files when I copied them over, and the DIR command is now showing them in that order (not alphabetical).

    So, if I set up RR to load the source music from a fileshare on the HT machine, the files get added properly, in alphabetical order. The same files, copied to the carPC, and loaded by RR locally on the carPC machine, are completely out of whack.

    I know I can build the playlist outside of RR and load it in RR, but I wish I could figure out why the files loaded properly on one machine, but as soon as I copied them to the actual machine I'll be using in the car, they're completely messed up.

    '01
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  2. #2
    FLAC edrex's Avatar
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    Do you have the same version of RR on both machines? Same config setup for both?
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  3. #3
    Constant Bitrate 01black_ac's Avatar
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    Yeah, the versions are the same, and the rrconfig is the same except for the music directory and playlist path...

    The important point here is that if I run RR from my carpc system, and load the music via a fileshare to the HT machine, which is the source from where I pulled all the albums/directories, the music gets added to the playlists properly.

    If I reconfigure the same copy of RR on the same carPC to load the music locally (copied from the HT machine and now sitting on the carPC machine) the files are completely screwed up...

    So, one copy of RR, two sources for the music, one is perfect alphanumeric, one is totally screwed up.

    '01
    Hang on while I defragment my car...

    the Acura ITX project
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  4. #4
    Constant Bitrate 01black_ac's Avatar
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    Okay, here's a strange thing... I took one entire directory of music which was showing up in reverse alphanumeric... I created a new folder on my desktop (the music storage is on the D: drive) and dumped the entire contents of that directory into the new folder on the desktop. I then deleted the directory itself from the D: drive, and recreated it... I then took the music from the desktop on the C: drive and dropped it back into the newly created directory on the D: drive.

    Now, when I list the DIR contents in the command prompt, they appear alphanumerically, and when they are added to the playlist in RR, they are also alphanumeric...

    What... The... F#%k ???

    '01
    Hang on while I defragment my car...

    the Acura ITX project
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  5. #5
    Constant Bitrate 01black_ac's Avatar
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    Okay, spent some time doing some reading this morning over coffee... It seems this is a FAT32 vs NTFS thing, which I had started to suspect last night. I'm posting this follow-up because there have been related posts on this subject on the forum and someone might find this useful.

    My HT machine is entirely NTFS, which is why the files get added to playlist in proper order, even when read over a fileshare by the carPC machine.

    The carPC machine itself is FAT32. I formatted it FAT32 because I figured it would add a little extra speed to the filesystem.

    However, the fact that it is FAT32 is what's causing the winamp playlist to be sorted out of order. It has to do with the FAT timestamp on the files.

    If anyone can confirm this on their end, it would be helpful before I convert my music drive to NTFS. Just open a command prompt on a drive that is FAT32, and do a 'dir' command... Are the files listed alphanumerically, or out of order? Same goes for NTFS, are they listed alphanumerically or no? My guess is those with NTFS will be 100% alphanumeric, and those with FAT32 will be less than 100% alphanumeric.

    Now, how much speed am I going to lose by converting my music drive to NTFS? Maybe not too much.

    By the way, I'm using winamp 2.91 with the May release of RR.

    '01
    Hang on while I defragment my car...

    the Acura ITX project
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  6. #6
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    If you browse into a folder, RR will sort and load the files in order. If you're loading multiple directories at once, RR will let winamp handle the loading of songs in the order they were written to disk (most likely). I've always used FAT32 because I hate to not be able to access my files from DOS if need be, still my songs always loaded in order (because I only load/add up to one folder at a time). I believe the only reason NTFS is helping is the fact it probrably sorts the files automatically for searching/indexing purposes.
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  7. #7
    Constant Bitrate 01black_ac's Avatar
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    Yeah, I did a few tests before converting the drive to NTFS.

    I tried manually copying album by album in alphabetical order, and that was the only way I could get the full list to add to the playlist properly. However, even when doing that, if I then added a new album somewhere in the middle of the alphabet, (say, Neil Young - Decade) it would then add the Neil Young album last in the list, even though alphabetically it was in the middle.

    So I just went ahead and converted the drive to NTFS and it works the way I want it to now. I just figured, since there were a lot of similar posts on this topic, others might find the info useful.

    '01
    Hang on while I defragment my car...

    the Acura ITX project
    the Acura ITX skin for RoadRunner
    project progress: 99%

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