Plugin for in/outside temp monitoring

WuNgUn · 01-11-2008, 11:22 AM

Seems rather straight forward for someone who know what they're doing...
I was thinking a plugin to work with a Phidget interface module and a couple of Phidget temp sensors.
One to monitor cabin temps and the other to monitor outside temps. Maybe even a warning system as the temp falls towards and below freezing?
That would be COOL!

pearl62 · 01-11-2008, 02:06 PM

Then just add the rotary encoder input (http://www.phidgets.com/products.php?product_id=1052), and then servo control (maybe this one - http://www.phidgets.com/products.php?product_id=1000), and we could have a complete HVAC control in CF!

Edit... Sorry, looks like somebody has already been working on this... http://forums.fluxmedia.net/showthread.php?t=1643

WuNgUn · 01-11-2008, 10:56 PM

That project, the car already has climate control...
My car does not however. But the possibility exists!

2k1Toaster · 01-11-2008, 11:29 PM

Just so you know all that is doable with the Fusion Brain as well for less money.

User "h3rk" is doing automatic climate control right now too.

WuNgUn · 01-11-2008, 11:42 PM

Dammit, I love this ****!!!!

pearl62 · 01-14-2008, 03:03 PM

I don't know about FusionBrain...

I can't find servo motor control mentioned anywhere. Phidgets offers so many different add on boards, manuals, source code. Fusion doesn't seem to offer much at all.

Also their pricing seems a little dodgy... the comparison on their website shows the Fusion Brain controller sells for $50, the catalog says $65, and when you add it to the cart its shown as $70!

h3rk · 01-14-2008, 03:38 PM

3 servos, and 3 of the driver circuits, and 3 usb ports. That would be a minimum for the phidgets servo setup. Then you have to find a way to rig those servos to control the doors. (keep in mind, 3 is a minimum for complete control of HVAC. Unless you have a vacuum setup, then maybe just 1. But there's a minimum of 3 doors.

I'd rather interface with the existing actuators, and minimize the hacking-up of the dash underside.

2k1Toaster · 01-14-2008, 04:16 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by pearl62

I don't know about FusionBrain...

I can't find servo motor control mentioned anywhere. Phidgets offers so many different add on boards, manuals, source code. Fusion doesn't seem to offer much at all.

Also their pricing seems a little dodgy... the comparison on their website shows the Fusion Brain controller sells for $50, the catalog says $65, and when you add it to the cart its shown as $70!

The comparison has not been updated.

The price is $65 fot the Brain. If you want a 6' USB cable and a DC jack to power it, which is default option #1, then it is $5 more. There is a drop down menu to select if you want the cables or not. If you dont want them, it is $65.

The brain was $50, but due to various reasons it is now $65. It is still waaaaaay cheaper than anything else with half as much goodies on it.

We have an entire subforum here for support, as well as we answer emails as immediately as possible.

We have fully customizable and skinnable software available, with a newer logic based version due out very soon (Uber Edition).

We have all the details provided to interface directly with the low level DLL's if you want in both C# and VB.

pearl62 · 01-14-2008, 04:48 PM

Ok, I'll check it out here. There just wasn't any links to support docs on the FusionBrain site.

Another thought was just using the Parallax Propellor chip (http://parallax.com/ProductInfo/Micr...7/Default.aspx), which can support direct video output. I could drive and sense just about anything with that, and output a nice graphical display to one of the composite video inputs on my LCD. I could even integrate a 3-axis accelerometer too for a nice G- meter on the same screen, or even add OBD gauge display.

I have a 96 Civic which has a cable actuator for the temperature only, the rest of the controls can be done with output relays I think. There is a guy here who has fabbed up a servo to control the temp, so I know it's possible.

Anyway, just brainstorming some ideas. I can solder, and write embedded code, so I'm not scared of a more embedded solution. Integration with CentraFuse would be the best though...

WuNgUn · 01-14-2008, 11:18 PM

So I'd need a servo to operate the temp dial and a servo for the vent selector...the fan speeds, rear defrost and A/C can be controlled as analogue outputs I'm assuming?
Then have it monitor interior temps, and have the PC control fan speed/temp to maintain the selected temp...
Am I missing anything else?

h3rk · 01-15-2008, 05:15 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by WuNgUn

So I'd need a servo to operate the temp dial and a servo for the vent selector...the fan speeds, rear defrost and A/C can be controlled as analogue outputs I'm assuming?

You could put a servo on the actual dials, or on the shaft of the door the dial controls, if you do it that way, you might want to try using masteros Aircon.

Rear defrost - Digital out/relay as no analog control is needed.

AC - the compressor would just be a digital out where you find the "AC request" lead from the existing controller to the ECU.

The blower motor is an analog thing, but:

It also draws something like 30-40 Amps.. Which is way, way, way too much for any of the controller I/O cards we're talking about on thier own.
If your setup has a blower resistor, you can just use some digital outputs to operate relays across the sections of the resistor. For variable speed, there are some more options, but from here it gets more custom. A power resistor can be controlled with a low power analog out (fusion has been working on one for a bit, I'm personally waiting on this patiently with my fingers crossed). Some power resistor/fan setups use Pulse width modulation, which is no good. I mean it's great and effficient and all, but there are not many PWM control methods available to us. I'm finding that a Honda power transistor placed in the air stream, like a blower resistor is a good solution, as it uses a direct analog votage control input.

Quote: Originally Posted by WuNgUn

Then have it monitor interior temps, and have the PC control fan speed/temp to maintain the selected temp...
Am I missing anything else?

Well that all depends on how "OEM" you want the control to work:

If all you want is "manual control" it's pretty straight forward. but if you want to be able to make the output temperature what the dial says with any accuracy, or even better you want it to control the actual interior temperature accurately. You have to account for sunload and ambient losses, & not just have it react temperature changes. Otherwise the control wil be all over the place, like a roller coaster. There are many other aspects of automatic control that I am presently working on, if you have any more specific questions (even vehicle specific) or ideas I'd be glad to lend a hand and share my experience. You might want to check out my modernity thread in the skins subforum of the fusion subforum, here. And also my Automatic AC control thread in the fusion subforum directly.

WuNgUn · 01-15-2008, 09:21 AM

Cool, cool...
Are you sure PWM's wouldn't be suited for this kinda motor control? It would give a nice, smooth stepless control. And I've built a few PWM in my day (for LED drivers)...

h3rk · 01-15-2008, 12:29 PM

PWM is the method of choice for many of the OEM Blower control signals and motor drive circuits (Chevrolet comes to mind, for starters). I have just avoided it, because it's not widely available for aftermarket methods of controlling these. And I'm not building a from-scratch PIC based solution. I suppose you could gut a more advanced HVAC controller and use the motor control module (usually seperate).

But if you have the desire and the skill, go for it. I'd be interested in seeing it done for this application.

WuNgUn · 01-17-2008, 10:17 AM

All the PWM I've built in the past have used a variable resistor to control the output...
Isn't there someway for the Fusionbrain to signal the PWM in a similar way?

hmmm...why was I thinking it had digital AND analogue outputs??

I've found out that most Fords with climate control use a linear voltage control device and not a PWM...
It receives an input of around 1.5v for low-speed fan operation, and a maximum of 5v for full power to the blower...
And it's totally variable inbetween.
I guess a digital output on the FB wouldn't be able to control this...

I guess Phidget is the better solution for this? They already have a 30A DC motor control module!!
http://www.phidgets.com/products.php?product_id=1064

And you don't even need the 'brain' for this module...it connects straight to the PC thru USB....YES!!!

I gotta findout if my cars blower is brushless or not (doesn't work with brushless)...I think almost all cars are brushed.

WuNgUn · 01-17-2008, 11:54 AM

I think I'm going to try this...
Phidgets 30A motor controller...
4-motor servo controller...
This should be able to control my HVAC (minus A/C, defrost, recirculate buttons)...
Now I need a couple of high-torque servos with almost 300 degrees of sweep...

This part of it I can handle...
Integrating it into Centrafuse, I don't even know where to begin!

I was also thinking a couple of temp sensors, humidity sensor, for which I'll need the interface module...and if I'm going to get that, I might as well get the accelerometer too!