Solvent adhesives... why don't more people use them? - Page 2

coachreed · 03-15-2005, 08:44 PM

Quantity of meltable ABS? Well, again, not the best material, but I used about one foot of schedule 40, 1.5" ABS plumbing pipe! I've got another 8-9 feet laying around... anyone want some?! lol

Coach... I mean Randy (I often forget who I really am)

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Squid · 03-16-2005, 03:50 AM

Why isn't that the best material? Thanks for the info... I have some projects I can
use this on... sorta excited to try something new!

Scouse Monkey · 03-16-2005, 04:58 AM

Just wanted to add some more safety advice for anyone who can't bothered to read the MSDS sheets (this is taken from the ones i have on my desk for my PU grade stuff)

Use nitrile gloves (other materials won' last very long)
Goggle and face protection
Don't inhale fumes and work with good ventilation or a fume cupboard if possible and use a suitable respirator (you will be spending a while witht his stuff moulding so don't take the risk - repiratory paralysis is in the list of possible side-effects from inhalation of larg quanities)
When disposing do not pour down the drain
Avoid contact with alkali metals, strong oxidising agents, ethanol and acetic acid (last two are explosive)

I would also use barrier cream under gloves.

This is quite an interesting idea Coach, think i will be trying this route as it should be a lot cheaper and stronger than bondo/fibreglass and easier to mod later for anything as you can simply melt the plastic again.

coachreed · 03-16-2005, 07:29 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Squid

Why isn't that the best material? Thanks for the info... I have some projects I can
use this on... sorta excited to try something new!

First off, the ABS pipe isn't the best because of the bulk... I ended up driving home with a big peice of pipe sticking out the window of my truck... I know, I could have cut it up, but it just wasn't convenient at the time! lol Other than that, the ABS pipe isn't as dense as a sheet of ABS... if you cut a peice of ABS pipe you'll notice that the core of the pipe is kinda poris... this just means you end up cutting, grinding or breaking up more plastic to get the same amount of goop... other than that, there isn't a problem with it... just not the most convenient.

As for the additional safety information from Scouse Monkey, you can never be too safe... don't let it scare you away from this process as I'm sure there are equaly alarming MSDS's for bondo and fiberglass... and if you use fiberglass, bondo, or polyster resins (the resin you use with fiberglass), you will most likely use Acetone as your cleaning solvent... soooo... do be skeered!

I'll take pictures tonight... my batteries are finally charged... TTYL!

Randy

Scouse Monkey · 03-16-2005, 08:27 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by coachreed

As for the additional safety information from Scouse Monkey, you can never be too safe... don't let it scare you away from this process as I'm sure there are equaly alarming MSDS's for bondo and fiberglass... and if you use fiberglass, bondo, or polyster resins (the resin you use with fiberglass), you will most likely use Acetone as your cleaning solvent... soooo... do be skeered!

Oh hell yeah, if you read the MSDS sheets for everything then you would enclose yourself in a plastic bubble and only eat the purest fruit and veg grown in controlled environments!

One good point to mention is there is no evidence of carcinogenic properties or mutagenic or teratogenic effects so no worries about turning into an X-man (or woman

)

So compared to working with MDF and carbon-fibre etc it is safer!

how dangerous is bondo dust?

Coach, you mean you didnt have your trusty swiss army knife or leatherman to cut the pipe?? Whats going on?

EsKALad · 03-16-2005, 12:26 PM

I was wondering would the abs plastic from radio install kits would work good. What do you all think? And can this be sanded down like bondo?

Pestilence · 03-16-2005, 12:28 PM

I was going to use glass reinforced bondo to fuse my bezels, but I found a place that sells bulk abs regrind today and will be picking up a bunch after work to try this method instead, since I live in arizona and summer is coming.

jweller · 03-16-2005, 01:45 PM

Ok this is good stuff. I've got a can of acetone in my garage already, so I just have to look for plastic stuff around the house to melt. Ought to be easy for a pack rat like me to find something lol

the dust from bondoglass is about the nastiest stuff around. itchy and it Fs my sinuses up even with a dust mask. I'll be glad to never touch the stuff again if I can.

Pestilence · 03-16-2005, 01:54 PM

I went out at lunch to home depot and found this product:

it contains MEK, acetone, and some ABS resin already. Plus it was about 6 bucks for 32 oz. I should be able to just thicken this a bit with some more abs and go to town

jweller · 03-16-2005, 02:01 PM

link doesn't seem to be working right. whats it called?

Pestilence · 03-16-2005, 02:44 PM

man - just my luck with pics today - it's oatey black abs cement - I found it in the plumbing section at home depot.

antimatter · 03-16-2005, 02:57 PM

Hey Coach...

Can you elaborate on the mixing process a little further. I am trying to pin down actual quantities.

I know it depends on how thick or thin you want your mixture to be but can you give us some guidlines.

Do you start with the acetone and then add the shavings or visa versa?

I guess those pictures would be very helpful here.

BTW this is a great idea. My friggen bondo (not the one with fiberglass hairs) is cracking. It cracked on one side and i fixed that side with the BondGlass and now the other side cracked. Arggg

dave2 · 03-16-2005, 05:27 PM

I'll share a couple other ideas.
Liquid plexiglas is a liquid acrylic that you can pour and sets up clear, plus it doesn't need any strengthening material like the fiberglass mat. The reason we use fiberglass with epoxy is that the resin doesn't cure stable, it cracks very easy and only has strength in thick blocks.
Also, MEK methyl ethyl ketone is polyester resin hardener. You can find it at any marine supply shop, along with fiberglass stores and plastic depot, like TAP plastics.
They will also have acrylic sheets and acrylic bonding solvents at TAP, and most of the pourable plastics.

The main reason people use fiberglass and bondo is because they don't pour, they spread. It's very difficult to make a reverse mold that you can FILL with an acrylic or ABS formula where it will come out smooth. It's much easier to sand bondo. That said, you can come up with some cool results using the acrylics.
I've used all of these methods extensively, and if anyone needs help with them, please ask.

coachreed · 03-16-2005, 09:20 PM

Mixing process elaboration... hmmm... lemme see just how specific I can get...

Get your handy-dandy condiment bottle from Walley-World and fill it up loosely with ABS shavings (lets stick with shavings because they are ideal as opposed to chunks)... pour a small amount (maybe a tablespoon or so) of solvent into the bottle... better to start off with a little and add as you go... much easier to thin it out than it is to thicken it up... you will see that your shavings don't go very far as you add the solvent... cap your bottle off and shake. Now you will probably have about 1/4 of a bottle of sludge... add more shavings and shake it up... you want a nice smooth, pudding consitency (for lack of better description). As I said, if you put too much solvent into the bottle, you may have a hard time adding enough ABS to thicken it up... if you want to test the consitency, just try squirting a little out of the bottle onto a paper towel or piece of scrap cardboard or the such.

Keep in mind also, if the mixture is thicker (less solvent), it isn't going to penetrate the plastic of the parts you are glueing together... at the same time, if the mixture is too thin (too much solvent), it will just seep through any crack or hole it can find and you'll have a big mess on your hands. I have found that once you have your parts set together, use masking tape to mask off the back side of your project to close off any holes that might let the glue ooze through.

I'll post pictures in a few minutes... brb...

coachreed · 03-16-2005, 09:39 PM

Here are a few pictures... again, sorry I didn't take pictures as I was doing this... its a real biotch when you can't find the digital camera! BTW, I noticed that I actually paid 25¢ for the condiment bottles during a seasonal closeout at Walmart... I bought a few sets... anyway... you can see in the picture entitled "back", that on the left side there is a glob of plastic... that is what happens when you don't mask things off and squeeze a thin mixture onto the project... I didn't realize it was that bad until a minut ago... the good news is that I can just grind it back off quickly and easily... and when I'm done, I won't be itching... try that with fiberglass! lol

Later!

Coach!

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