MisterSpy

I have tested out three different cams I got off eBay over the past few months and all of them seem to share the same problems. Two of them were CCD with infrared and were a little too large for my tastes, and one of them was a very small CMOS camera without infrared.

Anyway, on all of the cameras I used, during night driving the headlights of other cars coming towards your car really blind out the display, which is pretty disappointing. I tried mounting the cameras down by my license plate as well as way above it, but it didn't seem to matter. I think the lenses are desperate for light when it's dark out, so they "grab onto" as much as they can get in these conditions. Not good when you have headlights coming towards you. The CMOS camera was affected a lot more than the CCDs, but even on the expensive 1/3 CCD I bought, it was still pretty bad.

A similar problem also occured when it was clear out and the sun was setting. If you're driving with the back of your car pointed at the sun and it's really clear out...the direct sunlight also causes display issues. On the CMOS cam, the image would even turn brown/red.

I also noticed that the wider viewing range of the lens, the further away the images on the screen appeared to be.

With the 130 degree cam I had, a car that was almost touching my bumper when I looked at it through my rear view mirror, appeared on the camera like it was at least 1 car length away from me. That could cause problems..

The plus side to the 120 - 130 degree camera was that the viewing angle was so wide that a car coming up to the left of me that was only visible at that point through my left mirror was STILL visible on the camera for as long as it was visible in my left mirror.

The little 70 - 90 degree camera on the other hand gave a more accurate view of the distance between other cars and me, however, I basically could only see what was directly behind me and not what was coming up on my sides like I could with the wider angle cams.

The other one was somewhere between 90 and 120 but still wasn't quite right in either department.

So there doesn't seem to be a good compromise here. Seems like it's either wider view with incorrect distance, or narrower view with nearly correct distance.

I may be able to live with that, but there needs to be a way to get around this problem with incoming car headlights blinding out the display at night.

As long as these problems persist, I can't really see how these rear cams could realistically be used as "secondary rear view mirrors" like everyone hopes. Right now I think they're really only useful for what they're meant to do...helping you reverse.

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Enforcer

Nice review.

I think as you say in your last sentance, the main reason we would use these is for the reversing factor. I'm not sure I would have it onb while driving in a forward direction to see what's behind me.


However I might have second and third ones at a later date (just because I can sort of thing).

to combat the headlight and sunlight glare I think the cameras would have to have some sort of automatic iris which would reduce the amount of light coming in.

Maybe someone needs to butcher some nice expensive digital video camera which has this sort of function and try that. (any volunteers? )

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shotgunefx

Well the Nitemax Ultra Color CCDs support auto-iris, so last week I purchased a 3.5-8MM Auto-Iris lens for $25 shipped from this seller on ebay.

Most are (apparently) driven via DC or a VIDEO signal. Looks like the Ultra CCD works with both so either way, should be good.

I'll let you know how it goes when it gets here. It's a little more narrow then my other lens (~101 degrees at 3.5mm) , but being adjustable, figured it was worth it. They do have 2.8mm ones with autoiris as well, but they are a little more expensive.

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MisterSpy

I checked out some of those lenses that guy is selling, and while they look nice, what about for those of us who want a tiny/stealthy camera? The one I have right now has a diameter of slightly under 1 inch. You have to be within 5 feet of the car to even see it. What are the dimensions of the camera you're using now anyway?

shotgunefx

Here's the front cam, the new lens will be quite a bit taller.


The back is the Savv one which is smaller, but I'm going to be replacing it with the same one as the front (but hopefully in a more compact housing).



With the cams so close to the roof, you really can't see them when walking around the car

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ODYSSEY05

It seems that the Panasonic 20-TWCC200BAMT might be what we need to combat the glare problems. It claims that it "automatically adjusts light sensitivity for better viewing at night". But at $400+ it's a bit out of my reach.

shotgunefx

Check out this post, some vids of a nitemax ultra ccd hooked up to an auto-iris lens.

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ODYSSEY05

I found these cameras with auto-iris while googling:

Pioneer ND-BC1 Universal Color Rear-View Camera
http://www.cardomain.com/item/PIONDBC1

NAXEL V-100C True-Color Rear View Camera
http://www.naxel.com/products_accessory.htm

http://www.rfconcepts.co.uk/bullet_camera_colour.htm

http://jamcon.en.alibaba.com/product...ew_Camera.html

Looks like the Pioneer camera might be the only one that's affordable and obtainable ...

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shotgunefx

When they say auto-iris, I don't think they mean it in the real sense, but rather as in the CCD itself, which isn't as good as an actually iris AFAIK. Basically using DSP to try and improve the signal from what I understand.

As an aside, the nitemax (ultra anyway) do this as well, just not enough to compensate for the headlights. My Savv does even worse and that's an expensive reverse cam.

My thoughts...

The first one is way overpriced and only 1/4 ccd, the bigger the ccd, the better the pic.

Also rated for 1.5 lux which isn't good. The savv I have is rated for down to 0.2 lux

The second looks much better, but still wondering what they mean about electronic iris, if it's just the signal compensation, think you'll have the same problem as the others with glare.

Third seems alright, no idea what that is in USD.

Fourth one, 1/4" CCD unlike everyone else, they list the lux at F1.4 instead of 2 to make it look better.

If you can deal with making a housing and a little bit of work, you can grab one of the nitemax ultra ccd boards + a decent lens for under $50, not a bad deal at all. Probably a better CCD than most if not all of the ones above.

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MisterSpy

AFAIK all these cams have some sort of auto iris. I just don't think there's any you can find that won't be affected by the "bright light" problem.

BTW shotgune, is your rear cam mounted inside your car or outside on your rear bumper? Not really sure what the point would be of having a rear cam inside the car...because then it's no different from the view you get from a mirrior.

One of the reasons why I've been trying to find "the perfect" cam is because I have very dark (5%) tints on my car. When driving at night it's hard enough to see what's behind me with just my mirrors, let alone on a cam. Putting a cam inside the car and aiming at the rear glass would be pointless in my case.

I'm not giving up yet on finding a decent cam though..

shotgunefx

It's mounted inside the car, but it's a much better view than i have.

My car's *** is rather high and with the large rear pillars, the view is nothing.

With the camera on the roof in the back, the view is like sitting in the backseat with your head on the rear deck. So it's much wider and higher up than you'd get with the mirror.

Like so... (though in actuallity, the cam ended up going a little further towards the back glass)


For instance, these cones are placed at the edges of the FOV of the camera.



I thought about going outside and mounting it in one of those fake shark fin antennas, the view would be amazing then (I tried it by taping it to the roof), but it's a lot of work and I don't want to drill through the roof at this point. By having it on the inside roof instead of the bumper, I can almost see to my rear tires.

There's more pics earlier in this thread

Not sure if it's in this thread, but there's a 2.5mb video here

If the rear tint was a problem, I'd imagine you could cut out a square in the tint if you wanted to have it inside. Though you might be surprised, some of these cameras are very sensitive, might work even through it.

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sam604

is it worth it to get a ccd just to back up your car? cmos good enough even at night to back up your vehicle and not bump into anything?
anyone know how to mount these to your trunk keyhole? any pics?

Kosti

I guess as more and more cars are now comming out with reverse sensors and camera's this technology should get better and possibly smaller.

I plan on placing mine where the key goes to open the trunk/boot so side will not be a problem as the key barrel diameter is just under an inch.

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JasonWW

I just saw the setup in the new GMC Denali. The lens is about 3/8" diameter and somehow it is very bright while backing up in the dark. It was a fisheye lens. I know this isn't something you can order and hook up to your PC as they are probably expensive and interfce with the trucks computer system, but still, it seems to work very well at night.

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BreezeWaveFun

I have a 2000 RR, how did you run the wires?
Thanks.

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