F-Body Ideas - Camaro and Firebird - Page 17

JasonWW · 10-29-2006, 07:50 PM

Very few people are even going to see this monstrosity I'm building, just a handfull of family and a few friends. I guess this will be mostly for my own satisfaction as well as all you internet guys as I'll post pics and so forth.

I wonder if the whole thing can be made of wood?

JasonWW · 10-30-2006, 06:13 AM

If I can't find any better ways then I'll stick with what I know and make the outer structure from sheetmetal. It's what I know. That way the outer surface will be nice and straight and easily prepped for paint. Once the outer shell is finished I'll just start layering the inside with fiberglass until it's nice and thick.

I don't think fiberglass is going to bond really well to metal, so I can do a small section and see how strong it is. If the fiberglass breaks off I can line the sheetmetal shell with some kind of mold release stuff and then do the numerous layers of glass. Once finished I can bond the metal shell to the fiberglass enclosure with epoxy. Hopefully that will do the trick.

JasonWW · 10-31-2006, 02:07 PM

What would be a cool display of subs for the rear deck firing back or to the sides?

What haven't you seen?

A single 18" firing to the rear and up? That would be cool.

What about 2 12's with a 15" LCD in between and have the 12's facing slightly away from each other?

How about 4 10's with 2 firing to the rear and the 2 on the sides kind of angled away from the center?

I'd like to do something different and unique and possibly have more output than the single 15 idea. Elemental Designs makes a 18" sub that needs 2.5 cu ft sealed. In the dual 4 ohm I could give it 1200 watts. It's only 250 bucks.
http://www.edesignaudio.com/edv2/pro...products_id=37

I haven't bailed on the single 15" JBL W15GTi as that is probably the best SQ woofer out there, but it does have a weird dual 6 ohm VC. What's really cool about them is that they apparently work very well in a small 1.5 cu ft box! I kind of want to get 2 and drop them in a 3 cu ft enclosure, but my amps would get an odd load.

Are there any crazy ideas you'd like to see?

turbocad6 · 10-31-2006, 02:32 PM

ok, this may not be the best sq setup, but it's sure to be a pounder...

JasonWW · 10-31-2006, 02:37 PM

You know, I've had that same idea before a while back but forgot about it. There are these cardboard tubes designed for concrete columns that are really well suited for subwoofers. They are called sonotubes and you see them a lot in home theater setups.

I like that they can be made to look like missles or rockets as well.

JasonWW · 10-31-2006, 02:45 PM

I did a whole bunch of research on these about 6 months a go. There are some already built that resemble a drum.

I personaly don't like those (pics below) but I did have an idea based on congas. They look great but it is difficult finding a pair of the same size. Normally conga sets are not matched, one is smaller so that it has a different sound.

Check out those conga pics, aren't they beautiful?

The reason I gave up on them was because I thought they would have to mount up and down on the t-top well to sound good. They are slightly too wide for a pair of them there, but on the back deck, they just might work.

JasonWW · 10-31-2006, 02:52 PM

I'm not sure I'd go with the JL W7's as they are too pricey and there are much cheaper subs out there that are also very good sounding. I think I'm going to have to get a good upper range (SQ wise) sub instead of the best SQ sub like the W7 and GTi. There are a lot of good ones out there.

It would be nice to have a pair of 1000w class AB amps, but I'm stuck with the 600 watters. I think I just need to find subs that can reach their peak with 600-700 watts. I think I would have to go with 2 12's with the twin tube idea as I'm sure 15's would kill the rear vision.

JasonWW · 10-31-2006, 03:15 PM

Even if I run 13" tubes it willbe really tall and hurt thr rear vision. Not so much the from the rearview mirror, but when you turn your head around. I would need to notch the tubes around the front of the rear deck so that the tubes are tipped down in the front. I'll have to do some more testing on this idea.

Large PVC tubing can also work well. Does anyone know if PVC can be heated and bent? That would open up some ideas.

JasonWW · 10-31-2006, 03:34 PM

Something like this:

It's awesome and crazy all rolled into one!

JasonWW · 11-02-2006, 08:55 AM

I'm trying hard to find a way to use the JBL GTi subs as they seem excellent with high sensitivety and sound quality plus work very well in tiny sealed enclosures. Due to their dual 6 ohm VC's they create a 3 ohm load to each amp. I think my particular amps will handle that, although they are not rated for it. I'll have to ask some pro's I know. If 3 ohms bridged is no problem, I'll see about getting 2 12's and see if they will work in a drum shell called a super tumba. They are the biggest of the conga shaped drums at about 14" diameter. Typically the biggest congas you see are 11.5-12". For that size I'm sure a pair of 10's would fit without problem.

It's interesting to note that among the JBL GTi subs the 10, 12 and 15 are all within 1 dB sensitivity. (10" 90dB, 12" 91dB, 15" 92dB) I believe that this means a 10 will almost play as loud as a 12. Only 1 dB seperating them. With 2 subs, a pair of 12's will be only 2 dB more max than a pair of 10's. That's not very much at all. Does anyone know if there would be other differences, such as low end extension? If they would sound exactly the same and only be 2 dB less I would consider getting a pair of 10's and mounting them in the 12" congas. I'd rather have a pair of 12's in super tumbas, but the big SOB's are hard to find.

thunderdepot · 11-02-2006, 07:48 PM

Any ideas for a convertible f-body?

JasonWW · 11-02-2006, 10:00 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by thunderdepot

Any ideas for a convertible f-body?

For what, the subs? Sure, build a box that takes up the whole back seat. You need all the bass you can get as the convertible doesn't have the same type of corner loading that the hard tops have.

For more specifics as well as convertible boxes that go in the trunk, try the LS1tech convertible section:
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=84

If you want to keep the back seat, there are boxes you can build that fit in the trunk under the rear deck (some have vents that let the bass through when the top is down) and some fit in the well area. You could also do a removable box either using one side of the rear seat or one side of the passenger footwell. That way if you need to have more than 3 people in the car you can pop the sub out and put it in the trunk or leave it at home.

It will help if you are more specific in your needs and how much space you want to give up. In general, since there is not a lot of room, more output can be had with a bigger amp. Lets say the most you can fit is a single 10". To get the most out of it you would want a really big amp. Every time you double the power you will gain 3 dB until the limits of the sub is reached. So a single 10 with 600w would play 3 dB louder than a pair of 10's with 150w each. It would not only be louder, but use half the space.

JasonWW · 11-04-2006, 10:19 AM

My amps will do 3 ohms bridged barely, but they might blow up. I'm going to pass on this arrangement and stick to either a single JBL or else 2 of another brand.

After do a bunch of research on the conga idea, here is what I found. Most conga sets are 2 pieces, each different in size. Typically a 10" and a 11". Only the large Super Tumba would be big enough for 12" subs as they are 12.5"-13" in diameter. These are very hard to find, not to mention finding 2 identical ones.

I did however find a source for raw wood super tumbas for about $115 each. They don't normally ship them as they sometimes crack due to the weather changes during shipping. If you sign a note that all sales are final they will ship them out. The advantage is they are not yet drilled with all the holes plus you can get 2 of the same size. If they develop a crack, no big deal. Just seal them from the inside and put the crack on the bottom where it won't be seen. You would need to make a plug for the bottom, a mount for the sub on the top and then give it a finish. The shear expense involved is making me shy away from it.

I wish I knew of a giant 17+" conga shaped wood enclosure. I'd drop a single 15 in it. That would be cool. These things have the same curvy lines as the TA and check this out: Congas produce bass notes from hitting the skin with your hand. Now replace the hand with an electrical striker (voice coil) and replace the skin with a speaker cone. Using a conga or drum shell as a sub enclosure is pure poetry. It's like old school vs. high tech. Their both putting out the bass.

JasonWW · 11-04-2006, 10:24 AM

For those who want some ideas for big back seat systems, check this thread:
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showth...80#post5818380

There are some links to drlivingstons TA as well as DJsexays car near the end.

turbocad6 · 11-04-2006, 10:59 AM

I'm gonna guess conga drum walls are going to be no where near thick enough to be a non resonating enclosure... I'm also gonna guess that the shape & wall thickness can & do influence the overall sound of the conga when used as a conga... good thing for a conga, but bad thing for a sub enclosure.....

I think to use a conga shell with any kind of real power behind it, you will need to reinforce it well, & obviously from the inside, otherwise all the things that make it a good conga will make it a bad enclosure...

depending on the method of reinforcing it from the inside, you could wind up loosing a lot of box volume... other than that, I think this is a really unique idea, & I like the overall flow of the shape & all, but my vision of a setup like this would involve grafting a conga to a box, for the upper shape, it's a bit harder for me to really picture just a whole conga... now maybe with the bottom flattened, or I guess even notched the way youve shown maybe...

are you going to start with a finished piece or are you going to have to provide the finish, as far as stain, polyurethane etc?