Lets see those rearview camera mounts. - Page 3

shotgunefx · 11-09-2006, 04:51 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by 2k1Toaster

I've got 15% or 20% and it is not that dark, but at night, I can see the headlights of cars, but not the cars. That is actually why I want to do this. Not for bling-bling, but for safety. I protected my CarPC, but put myself in danger!

What model is that camera? NiteMax ???? And at night, the IR works through your tint pretty well?

The cam in that pic is a Savv RV5000. The night quality is not that great. Very noisy You can see but it's a bit noisy. It's not IR at all, or rather, no IR illumination. Most of the zero lux cams you see are F/2 cameras with some IR leds which don't illumiate very far so it's pretty much BS.

Here's a pic of the nitemax out the front with no headlights at night, no IR, nothing. Pretty amazing it can get that good of a pic, there aren't even streetlights there (except at the intersection ahead)

The problem is this. (taken at the intersection you see in the distance in the first pic)

Just too sensitive. I tried an auto-iris camera, but still not good enough. Some better lenses (or at least one I have) have an option (a screw) that allows you to adjust it for center weighted illumination or to be sensitive to point sources (like headlights), haven't come across a small or cheap one though. One of these days, going to try some polarizing film to see if it helps, or maybe trying to jury rig a sensor to detect it and drive the Iris myself.

The brightness problem might not be a big deal for you as if you have a car behind you, you know there's a car there, even if you can only see the lights.

shotgunefx · 11-09-2006, 04:55 AM

Here's a vid showing two problems, the noise on the savv at night, and the nitemax getting drowned out by overcast daylight

2.7mb divx

sama · 11-09-2006, 05:43 AM

correct me if I'm wrong, but surely it's better to use your rear view and wing mirrors, than it would be to mount a rear view camera inside the cabin.

I can't speak first hand as I haven't put one in yet, but I imagine the camera on the rearmost part of the car would be better as you get to see what you otherwise can't.

Has anyone tried both ways? How do they compare in real life?

shotgunefx · 11-09-2006, 06:10 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by sama

correct me if I'm wrong, but surely it's better to use your rear view and wing mirrors, than it would be to mount a rear view camera inside the cabin.

I can't speak first hand as I haven't put one in yet, but I imagine the camera on the rearmost part of the car would be better as you get to see what you otherwise can't.

Has anyone tried both ways? How do they compare in real life?

I do use my mirrors as well, the problem is this. The large rear pillars and the height of the deck makes for a horrible view. The side mirrors help, but it involves a lot of craning, which means not looking looking forward. The narrow view of the side mirrors doesn't help either.

This pic gives you an idea of camera vs rear, the side mirrors aren't in this pic but you get the idea.

The dark represents the blind spots and why the cam is positioned the way it is.

It's like having someone sitting looking out the back window. That is a help. I have a vid that demonstrates it quite well. I'll try and find it. I'm backing out of my angled spot and there is a truck next to me. I can't see anything, as I'm backing out, a car comes barreling through the lot perpindicular to I am (from the side the truck is parked on).

Because of the cam, I saw him coming after moving a foot, without it, I would have had at least 5 or 6 ft of my *** hanging out before it would have been possible to see him and probably would have gotten smacked.

update Also, the cam is closer to the rear glass in reality then in this pic. The location pictured was where I planned on having it initally.

sama · 11-09-2006, 06:13 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgunefx

Just too sensitive. I tried an auto-iris camera, but still not good enough. Some better lenses (or at least one I have) have an option (a screw) that allows you to adjust it for center weighted illumination or to be sensitive to point sources (like headlights), haven't come across a small or cheap one though. One of these days, going to try some polarizing film to see if it helps, or maybe trying to jury rig a sensor to detect it and drive the Iris myself.

adjusting to brightness is a lifelong problem with computer vision, and most solutions work by using some iris adjustment, which is not great since you have to adjust the entire scene based on some value you determine. You may average the whole scene or take a center weigth.

the best soltuion avaialble, as far as I know, is to have a ccd that has a high dynamic range (HDR). That is, when hit with a load of light, it can still differeniate dynamics within that region, rather than just show a white/yellow blob. that way, adjustments can be made to local regions and you would end up with a very rich and clear image. of course, these ccd's dont' come cheap!

Then, using some software to do some localaised histogram-based adjustemnts, a very clear image can be obtained.

shotgunefx · 11-09-2006, 06:26 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by sama

adjusting to brightness is a lifelong problem with computer vision...
Then, using some software to do some localaised histogram-based adjustemnts, a very clear image can be obtained.

A cpu based solution is out for me. No interest in realtime processing of the video. Need to find a mechanical solution that works "good enough"

sama · 11-09-2006, 07:23 AM

For sure I think that having a cam is a good idea. What I'm questioning is its placement within the cabin s outside in the bootlid/bumper.

from your explanation, I can see a good case for having inside the rear most of the cabin, so that you can see objects approaching the sides. A camera mounted in the bumper would not be able to see that, since it would be at more than 90 degrees to the view of the camera

as for the brightness, a HDR camera would still help, a lot

sama · 11-09-2006, 10:16 AM

well I've been doing some research and I've found some very interesting thigns out. CMOS cameras are much better at dealing with glare than CCD cameras as one guy told me from a decent company.

the website speaks for itself!

ok, they're very pricey, at 800 euros for the most basic 8bit monochrome model, it's quite a hit

joan · 11-09-2006, 02:43 PM

I had to drill a hole to mount mine, but in my case is only a plastic piece, so if in future I would revert to initial status, I only had to buy this piece.

pRoFiT · 11-14-2006, 03:16 PM

Okay i found it today. Saw this at costco. Cant find on there site but found it here. It screws to your license plate.

http://www.roadmasterusa.com/backupcamera_vr3.php

Hope this helps.

legacy05gt · 11-14-2006, 04:09 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by pRoFiT

Okay i found it today. Saw this at costco. Cant find on there site but found it here. It screws to your license plate.

http://www.roadmasterusa.com/backupcamera_vr3.php

Hope this helps.

Can't tell you how many times i see this ^^ in my rear view...

I guess the milfs just love my suby...

sivart321 · 11-14-2006, 07:25 PM

I find I don't really need the IR emitters. The trick I use, is to press on the brakes lightly when I am reversing. The red light works just as good as the white light when it is dark out. There is no way I would have installed a reverse cam if it had to be the huge ones with the lights around them.

NiSlo · 11-14-2006, 07:38 PM

^^^^
That looks like an excellent install.
Was it tricky drilling the cover and housing to fit the camera? Also does your brake light look much different (have a big black spot in the middle of it)?

shotgunefx · 11-14-2006, 07:38 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by sivart321

...
I find I don't really need the IR emitters. The trick I use, is to press on the brakes lightly when I am reversing. The red light works just as good as the white light when it is dark out. There is no way I would have installed a reverse cam if it had to be the huge ones with the lights around them.

Nice stealthy install

sivart321 · 11-14-2006, 11:14 PM

Not much difference, the 3rd brake light had 3 bulbs in it originally... the way it is now, it's only slightly dimmer than before. Hardly noticeable.

I bought an extra third brake light from a the classifieds section of another forum in case I screwed mine up. I ended up using a step drill and got it to work the first time without problems. I used black silicone to seal the outside, and epoxy to secure the rear of the camera in the housing. The reflector is still in tact, so the other 2 bulbs still reflect some in the center outputting a little light.