Regulator and shutodwn - APC

skassama · 01-06-2004, 12:27 AM

Hi,

I just picked up a PC 500 watt ups for 19$( its on sale with mail in rebates) from office depot. check edealinfo.com

My idea is if I give switched 12 volts ( 13.8 to be exact)with a 5 amp diode, I should be able to configure it that the pc stays on for some time and then the APC sw will do a graceful shut down or hybernate

This gives me the following

1) ability ot withstand a crank
2) Shut down controller
3) start up with power on
4) regulated voltage with spike suppressor

SO tell me what can go wrong ? or if I have some limitaions which I have not thought of

skassama · 01-06-2004, 02:28 PM

anybody ..... ??? :-(

Bravellir · 01-09-2004, 08:28 PM

Well, not a answer but just adding to your question..

I can get my hands at a brand new 350Va Unit for 55€.
My current setup ( MKII), doesn't have any kind of solution to the shutdown/crank problem. Just one inverter conected to a standard micro atx power suply with remote power switch.

My ideia is similar. Just plug the UPS betwin the inverter and the PC power suply. When I shutdown the Car, the inverter will lose power, so the UPS will shutdown the pc.

Yep, the opus its a much more elegant solution, but at this stage, i'm holding it and a few other gadgets for the MKIII

So, what are we missing?? skassama and I ?? Would this work??

deadweasel · 01-09-2004, 09:03 PM

Something is nagging at me about it. It seems too perfect. I wonder: how much juice does a UPS draw while charging the battery? Bear in mind that when using one, you draw your power from the battery, not the electrical system, so it will always be charging. Will a car's electrical system be able to maintain what that UPS is looking for? Bear in mind that those things are meant for home/business use, so they may draw more power than the car is able to provide.

Just a thought.

skassama · 01-09-2004, 09:24 PM

Hardly any.... as it is a very slow charger... ie 12 hours to charge the battery.....

I believe that the total power consumpution should not be over 80 watts including power drawn by the computer ( C 134 in my case).

When the car is off, it will not charge and will shutdown the computer within a pre determined time, ie 8 min.....

I dont have a AC amp meter to check actual current , but can putt a dc amp meter before the inverter and give a reading for the amps for all ie, inverter, ups and pc.

UrbanDragon · 01-20-2004, 09:31 PM

Skassama have you implemented the UPS yet? Reading through the forums I'm getting the message that a UPS won't work properly in this kind of setup...

skassama · 01-21-2004, 05:49 PM

I have tried it with my laptop and it works fine.......

Since then we have been kind of busy and now are parents of a beautiful girl ....... so carputer is off my foucs for now..... :-)

MSUC5Vette · 04-02-2004, 10:20 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by skassama

I have tried it with my laptop and it works fine.......

Since then we have been kind of busy and now are parents of a beautiful girl ....... so carputer is off my foucs for now..... :-)

I tried plugging a belkin UPS into my inverter, and the UPS does not recognize the inverter as an AC power source.

Has anyone gotten this to work?

david_594 · 04-02-2004, 10:55 PM

you may have issues with the power supply actually shutting down. You said you want to run 12 volts input to it, but doesnt the APC only switch over to battery when the 120 ac cuts out? I think something like this(unless your using an inverter) would only work if it somehow converted all the power running through it to 12 volts then back to 120ac, but im almost positive they dont do that.

MSUC5Vette · 04-14-2004, 05:46 PM

Has anyone torn appart a UPS to see what volt battery it uses?

What I think would be helpful would be to bypass the AC input on the UPS some how and use the cars DC to charge the UPS battery. Connect it by a relay so when the car is turned off it is no longer connected to the vehicle battery.

This way you could have the computer on for say 15 minutes while you show it off in a parking lot, or run a quick errand. If it is on too long the UPS will shut down the computer.

Shoryuken · 04-15-2004, 11:52 AM

one possible issue would be battery drain on the UPS. My belkin (small office) ups takes 12 hours to fully charge after a power outage. Seems to me that if you drive lots of short distance trips, over a few days, the UPS would eventually drain, given that you'd be outputting more UPS battery power than you were adding in short (30 mins or less) trips.

Seems like 2 - 3 times per week (or more) you'd have to make a major 4+ hour trip to maintain battery.

Does that seem logical to anyone else? I'm not an expert by any means, just one snag I thought of.

SJC · 04-16-2004, 04:33 PM

Hmmmm, on the same train of thought, why couldn't we just disconnect the battery leads from the UPS (it's a standard lead-acid battery inside) and reconnect directly to car's 12v and ground? The battery in the UPS might be a 6v, but other than a regulator I can't see any potential issues....

Maybe, maybe the inverter in the UPS doesn't disappate heat well enough to be used as full time as it would need to be?

Thoughts?

MSUC5Vette · 04-17-2004, 01:08 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Shoryuken

one possible issue would be battery drain on the UPS. My belkin (small office) ups takes 12 hours to fully charge after a power outage. Seems to me that if you drive lots of short distance trips, over a few days, the UPS would eventually drain, given that you'd be outputting more UPS battery power than you were adding in short (30 mins or less) trips.

Seems like 2 - 3 times per week (or more) you'd have to make a major 4+ hour trip to maintain battery.

Does that seem logical to anyone else? I'm not an expert by any means, just one snag I thought of.

I'm a little confused here, assuming the UPS is charged when you put it in the car, and we can get it to consider an inverter a valid power source it would never even go to battery power except when the inverter is turned off. If you killed the UPS, it may take a while to charge, but after the initial charge (12hours before you use it out of the box) how long does it take to charge?

Quote: Originally Posted by SJC

Hmmmm, on the same train of thought, why couldn't we just disconnect the battery leads from the UPS (it's a standard lead-acid battery inside) and reconnect directly to car's 12v and ground? The battery in the UPS might be a 6v, but other than a regulator I can't see any potential issues....

Maybe, maybe the inverter in the UPS doesn't disappate heat well enough to be used as full time as it would need to be?

Thoughts?

This was essentially my question too, have you torn one apart to verify the voltage?

SJC · 04-19-2004, 11:59 AM

My UPS is a BackUPS Office, and the battery in it is an "HC 1217W" which after a quick google shows up as a 12v... That makes things easier, next step is to see if I need to regulate it at all before hooking it up to the battery.

Also, I think mine beeps when on backup power, so that little buzzer will have to be ripped out...

nl4jy · 04-20-2004, 12:36 PM

Okay...here's my shared of info on this subject...

*Note* I have done this setup...

I was using the APC 500 UPS...disabled the audio alarm so it wouldn't beep...
Fully charged it at home before installing it in my car.
Running off a 300 watt inverter...

This is what I found...and I did make a post about it eariler...
Battery would not charge for first 3-5 minutes...
Why? Cause (based on another post answer) the Inverter is not giving off a sine wave... In the UPS software...The UPS is only detecting 88v from line...(normal is 120v)

The lowest setting I can configure my UPS is 87v...yet it refuse to detect a good line till 3-5 minutes later...

Then many times...it'll kick in battery cause the 88v is very unstable...(if there's a way i can lower the UPS settings to 60v problem probably solved)

Now there's a problem with the PC draining the UPS...Although the PC is off...it's still draining battery...after a long weekend of not using it...the UPS Battery is completely empty....and a result...cannot retain a chage long enough to power up the PC...I had to plug the PC directly back to the inverter.

So because I wanted to save a few buck in not investing in a Opus...not only will I probably gonna buy an Opus...but I already wasted extra money on this UPS. (>_<)

Oh well...I guess I'll use the UPS for something else then...