Fastest bboting front end? - Page 2

Rezern · 09-18-2009, 03:54 PM

I'm not really a linux fan, but have liked what I've seen on ICE:P
Have also the option of installing a micro xp version and adding an front end, don't know if this will be any faster/beter.?
Also are aware of the risk of not getting things to work straight away, and since I can't do anything regarding error fixing and stuff on linux I would probably end up installing an XP front end if any major errors occur.
But if the linux system would install flawless and I could save 10s on boot, I would go for the linux.

Punky · 09-18-2009, 04:13 PM

At the rate of development that i've been seeing with LinuxICE, I can see it being a real alternative to windows FE in the coming future.
I also noticed that Kev works as hard at promoting the software, and encouraging other developers as well.
My only suggestion would be to polish up LinuxICE's UI, to look nicer! that'll always bring more users and developers. Right now it looks really dull in my opinion.
Linux has many desired features for carpc uses. One the ability to rip and tear the entired os to costumized at the operator's technical skills. Two usb booting. Plus many others!

kev000 · 09-18-2009, 04:24 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by nobb

How does the install and ease of use of OpenICE compare to other Linux solutions (figure Id ask you since you seem like somewhat of a linux fan

)? The reason why I (and probably many others) would be very hesitant to try out a linux based system is just because of the familiarity to windows. The interface of a linux based front end might be simple, but to install it and to get everything working initially seems to be a pain in the ***. Whereas with something like windows 7, you just follow the instructions, install it and go. Linux seems that you need to do a whole whack of research and searching to accomplish anything.

And if a linux front end takes around 20 - 30s to load up, then that seems very comparable to a windows system that just hibernates.

Back in the linuxice 1.0beta days, I had my slow epia carpc resuming from hibernate in < 11s. Kantlivelong's gentoo install running just nghost cold boots in about that fast. It would usually be on before my screen would warm up enough to see anything :P.

Linux can hybrid suspend also (suspend + hibernate). However, that isn't currently one of the LinuxICE features, so you'll have to configure it yourself.

The LinuxICE install is roughly the same as Ubuntu except it will require 2 extra steps. Here's the outline:

1 - Run install
2 - run ice configure (enables autologin among other things)
3 - run icetouch to install/calibrate your touchscreen.

The current LinuxICE2 builds have 2 major defects: 1 - sound isn't working, and 2 - there is no UI for wifi management. So like mal|com2973 said, unless you like tweaking and learning a new OS, LinuxICE may not be for you *yet*. Wait until we get the bugs worked out.

RipplingHurst · 09-18-2009, 06:12 PM

Answer to the question:

NOT Centrafuse. (it's slower than XP itself, depending on the playlist size that it was playing, the GPS, no. of plugins, etc.)

justchat_1 · 09-18-2009, 06:41 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by malcom2073

Ubuntu is one of the easiest Linux distros to get in to for windows users, that is true. It's really easy and straightforward to set up and not entirely difficult to use if you read the start-up guides.

On the other hand, there is a serious lack of Linux frontends... nGhost being one of the only ones. RevFE is Linux compatable, but is not officially supported with binary releases yet.

To be honest, unless you are looking to tinker and learn a new operating system, you should probably stick with Windows (as much as I hate to say it), and run RevFE which is really really fast (as much as I love to say it). That being said, LinuxICE is making leaps and bounds in the way of a one touch and go operating system/frontend, so you should definitely check it out before making any decisions

Hey what happened to a plug for Open Mobile :P

For anyone else reading....Open Mobile can currently run on Linux, Windows or Mac - all with the same release (thanks to mono).

DarquePervert · 09-18-2009, 07:10 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by RipplingHurst

NOT Centrafuse. (it's slower than XP itself,

What does this even mean?

This makes no sense.

You're comparing an operating system and a front-end software. The two are completely different.
Never mind that you applied conditions to your statement.

malcom2073 · 09-18-2009, 07:11 PM

Lol, someone didn't read the thread... just the title I think

justchat_1 · 09-18-2009, 08:20 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by DarquePervert

What does this even mean?

This makes no sense.

You're comparing an operating system and a front-end software. The two are completely different.
Never mind that you applied conditions to your statement.

I cant resist jumping in on this

It actually does.....even though they're completely different concepts both an operating system and the front end that run on it have a load time.

And having seen a few centrafuse installs with 20+sec load times, the whole slower then it takes XP to boot thing could be true.

nobb · 09-18-2009, 09:26 PM

YES! CF itself takes longer to load up than XP to boot. But yea I also think that the Linux FEs need to be a bit more polished and better looking as far as the UI goes. It's actually a pretty important reason why I chose CF...because it's so much more sexier than all the other FEs Ive tried.

kev000 · 09-18-2009, 11:47 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by justchat_1

Hey what happened to a plug for Open Mobile :P

For anyone else reading....Open Mobile can currently run on Linux, Windows or Mac - all with the same release (thanks to mono).

I didn't know you were trying to keep interop in mind. I'll have to give openMobile a try on my box, see how it runs on the *nix.

DarquePervert · 09-19-2009, 06:27 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by justchat_1

I cant resist jumping in on this

It actually does.....even though they're completely different concepts both an operating system and the front end that run on it have a load time.

And having seen a few centrafuse installs with 20+sec load times, the whole slower then it takes XP to boot thing could be true.

Quote: Originally Posted by nobb

YES! CF itself takes longer to load up than XP to boot. But yea I also think that the Linux FEs need to be a bit more polished and better looking as far as the UI goes. It's actually a pretty important reason why I chose CF...because it's so much more sexier than all the other FEs Ive tried.

And all those slow load times of front-ends (CF or any other)....
I'd be willing to bet that they are a result of poor OS optimization and/or slower hardware.

Until you compare front-end load times on the same hardware setup, you will never have an accurate picture of which loads faster and which loads slower.

BTW... RevFE loads lightning quick. Just something to mull over.

nobb · 09-19-2009, 10:27 AM

IMO, for a front end to be easy to use I dont think it should require too much of the user having to optimize OS or hardware, or even poking around the settings too much. There is a common trend of users saying CF is slow to load, so it's not just me. But I guess from a developer's view, to cram all those features and still be fast is challenging.

I've compared FEs on the same computer using Microsoft virtual PC 2007, and in my experience so far, in terms of speed from slowest to fastest: Centrafuse < Road Runner < StreetDeck < FreeICE < LinuxIce2

And coincidentally, from a usability, good aesthetics, ease of use, and "best" front end standpoint, I would reverse the list such that the slowest front end is the best and vice verse. So I guess you cant have it all. But in choosing a front end, waiting a few extra seconds for it to load is often worth it for the extra usability.

malcom2073 · 09-19-2009, 10:39 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by justchat_1

Hey what happened to a plug for Open Mobile :P

For anyone else reading....Open Mobile can currently run on Linux, Windows or Mac - all with the same release (thanks to mono).

I had no idea it could run on linux, that's fairly awesome

The more plugins you have, the longer something will take to load. CF and RR have way more plugins than nGhost and RevFE combined due to their maturity. I think a longer load time is acceptable IF the frontend is quick once it loads. Waiting an extra 5 seconds to load is better than waiting an extra second for each screen when you switch screens. This is a point that is lost on many. I think the discussion on which frontend is the fastest to load is silly for this reason.

justchat_1 · 09-19-2009, 11:56 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by nobb

I've compared FEs on the same computer using Microsoft virtual PC 2007, and in my experience so far, in terms of speed from slowest to fastest: Centrafuse < Road Runner < StreetDeck < FreeICE < LinuxIce2

And coincidentally, from a usability, good aesthetics, ease of use, and "best" front end standpoint, I would reverse the list such that the slowest front end is the best and vice verse. So I guess you cant have it all. But in choosing a front end, waiting a few extra seconds for it to load is often worth it for the extra usability.

You forgot one in there...*cough cough*

Not true at all and a very common misconception. Having to wait for everything to load is just bad design. For single threaded and outdated languages like vb6 in road runner that might be the only choice. But modern software should be able to load only whats necessary for the initial display, loading the rest on a background thread.

DarquePervert:
Slow hardware??!?! Come on lets be realistic....

I can do a comparison of load times on the same hardware for all the windows front ends...would that be useful to anyone or am i gonna get excuses like "its just my hardware"?? Would I need to do actual video or is a table of average timed runs good enough?

NibbleIT · 09-19-2009, 12:37 PM

A couple more things to consider:

1. Most car psu's take around 3-5 seconds from ignition on to power being supplied to the pc
2. Most pc's take around 10-12 seconds to complete bios initialisation

So if cold booting or resuming from hibernation you're upto 17 seconds before the O/S gets a sniff!

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