Why do people think RR is hard to setup? - Page 2

Machinehead · 04-28-2008, 09:00 AM

I played with CF a few months ago. It's pretty good, and handled hibernation better than RR does with my hardware. My biggest gripe was the lack of any decent looking skins and the fact that skins don't carry over from version to version.

kev000 · 04-28-2008, 10:11 AM

Quote:

i find the problem with open source is you are always "waiting" for people to implement, and if the developer base is large then i think it makes the system too complicated,...

Actually, it's almost a known fact that large projects benefit more from following an open source model than do large monolithic corporations.

The distributed model allows open source projects to release far more often than commercial projects. That's why ubuntu can release a brand spanking, bleeding edge version every 6 months, and the kernel can release a new subversion every 3 months. In contrast, it took microsoft 5 years??? to release a new version of their Windows operating system.

However, you are right that things *can* get complex to manage. But only if you don't do it right

jonessc · 04-28-2008, 10:25 AM

RR is just as easy to setup as any other front end, and I have to say ive always got good help when im stuck. Because it doesnt look as fancy as the other front ends websites, its not perceieved to run 'streight out of the box' like other FE's claim.

RR has a good mix of skinners, programmers, and hardware guru's that keep RR way above the rest of other front ends, and best of all it's free, the only money thats required is donations for the good work these guys do.

CarComp · 04-28-2008, 10:29 AM

RR needs to have the ability for you to just "click ok" and it will be ready to go without configuration. It doesn't have a default skin. Thats mainly the only thing. There should be an installer with a skin, or a checkbox to use a certain skin, or even the ability to download a skin on command from the installer. Maybe some pictures of available skins etc with checkboxes beside them. I know its doable.

I just installed RR last night again, and well I didn't know what website to go to at first, also I didn't know which installer was "THE RIGHT ONE" without reading a lot about what everything is. With mediaengine there is just one installer, and thats the one you use. Maybe there needs to just be a stickied post that says "CLICK HERE TO DOWNLOAD ROADRUNNER" and all that is in it is a post to the exe that works, with skins, and runs as soon as its done (granted the setup screen should show, but it should walk you through setup. msgbox such as "You will be prompted to select a skin" etc.)

Let me know what you think.

shiltz · 04-28-2008, 09:46 PM

Well I know I found RR hard to set up, actualy I couldn't figure it out to work and gave up and stuck with Frodoplayer, I wanted to try something new that was supported but I installed RR and ran in and it doesn't work, was looking for files it didn't have or something like that, definitly not the greatest in terms of installs, should at least install enough to get it up and running.

kbreeden · 05-06-2008, 11:45 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by danielkh

Ok, I'm messing with RR DFX3 and have come across an example of my "Programmer A not knowing what programmer B is doing". This has nothing to do with DFX3 but rather the skins included.

I'm messing around with the music interfaces. Love the internet radio and now looking at jukebox. You search for music, find something to play, and it starts. But it has also rewritten your current playlist to that only song (andc anything else you select in JB). It's also downloaded it to some strange place (I finally found it), and if you go back and try to play something else, it plays them both at the same time. Fantastic ideas, but they just don't play nice together.

That's the 20% I don't retract.

Not that example alone, but problems like it. Multiple programmers create multiple problems. Individually, they are fantastic! But together, they didn't know how to interact.

Nope, you're wrong. JohnWPB has made it clear that Jukebox is still in development and is supplied as a beta. If you don't like its shortcomings at this stage, you are free not to use it. I have been using RR with DFX for over two years now and am amazed at how stable it is.

Tidder · 05-06-2008, 12:05 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by russoxley187

Roadrunner is great, and free of course...
I do however like streetdeck and Cf, but its a little pricey for me.
$300 for some software to run in my truck? I don't make that much money.
If it was $100 i most likely do it. I know it costs to develop these great progs, but thats just a little to high for me.

Amen. I absolutely love RR these days, but I started off as a CF lover. I helped test with all the betas and blah blah blah, but in the end they're just out to make money. Guino on the other hand is in it for the pure love of the game. And I love that! He has a passion for this, whereas others are treating it like a job and cutting other's throats with high prices. I wanted to use CF in a fleet of 20 trucks for an oilfield company, and I think I got $5 off each copy... wow. And this was when they were first starting out, before it was publicly available for purchase. You'd think they'd be interested more in just getting their name out there. C'mon guys, it's SOFTWARE. Bah, I'll get down off this soap box.

Anyway, I too am guilty of thinking that RR is too hard to install. And back in the day, it kinda was. I was scared of it. Didn't know what to do, how to set things up, readme's n things were unclear and often out of date. So I even wrote my own winamp frontend to use, worked great for a while until I wanted to add more. So I came back to RR, and it's gotten much MUCH better. I love it I must say. And with some of the skins out there, it looks like CF. I've always loved CF's default skin.

MatrixPC · 05-06-2008, 03:38 PM

If we can come up with an installer like the original Media Car for RR then all other front end will shutdown their shop. I mean for real.
Yes RR has been out for several years and still not a lick and play FE. If I was to install it from scratch, I will run into problem like any one new to the game, but I can get around and fix it because I know how.
There are few ini files that are needed by RR, but the rest are installed by skin or whatever that I have no clue of. I RR setup in the Matrix is a big MESS. I don't know which file to delete and which are needed. I ended up delete all files that I am not sure and if thing break, restore it back from recycle bin.

To make RR better, I think some should come up with a short description of what each file is and what use it.
Ex.
RR.ini -> RR initialized, setting.
resume.ini -> store resume data upon restart RR.

motionlock.ini, screenlock.ini, tripmeter.ini ??? what the hell are those file (well I know what they are), but those are NOT needed by RR. Those install by skin and should be store somewhere else.

Yes, I use RR and it the only FE I use the most (Media Car, Frodo ...)
RR is much better and easier than in the pass year, but it is still a FE that you need to do some reading before it will play without a problem.

2k1Toaster · 05-06-2008, 05:28 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by CarComp

I just installed RR last night again, and well I didn't know what website to go to at first, also I didn't know which installer was "THE RIGHT ONE" without reading a lot about what everything is. With mediaengine there is just one installer, and thats the one you use. Maybe there needs to just be a stickied post that says "CLICK HERE TO DOWNLOAD ROADRUNNER" and all that is in it is a post to the exe that works, with skins, and runs as soon as its done (granted the setup screen should show, but it should walk you through setup. msgbox such as "You will be prompted to select a skin" etc.)

Let me know what you think.

Quote: Originally Posted by shiltz

Well I know I found RR hard to set up, actualy I couldn't figure it out to work and gave up and stuck with Frodoplayer, I wanted to try something new that was supported but I installed RR and ran in and it doesn't work, was looking for files it didn't have or something like that, definitly not the greatest in terms of installs, should at least install enough to get it up and running.

Quote: Originally Posted by MatrixPC

Yes, I use RR and it the only FE I use the most (Media Car, Frodo ...)
RR is much better and easier than in the pass year, but it is still a FE that you need to do some reading before it will play without a problem.

I dont know what you guys are doing, but in the stickied thread in the RR forum with the installer, I download it. I download winamp. Install winamp. Install RR via the installer. Both of these are just next,next,next,finish type deals. After that RR Config pops up. I click the music path box, set to my music drive. Click the music types, select mp3. click save and exit. Double click RR icon on the desktop, and RoadRunner is playing the winamp llamma tune, everything works.

It comes with the default skin that works just fine. You never need to touch an ini file. Didnt need anything else.

so to reiterate:

what is so difficult about this!?!?

We have computers in our cars. You would think that downloading 2 files, and running 2 installer packages wouldn't be too far out of reach.

Jebus · 05-06-2008, 06:02 PM

I Want it all, I Want it all, I Want it all, And I Want It Now!

...JJG

shiltz · 05-06-2008, 06:42 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by 2k1Toaster

I dont know what you guys are doing, but in the stickied thread in the RR forum with the installer, I download it. I download winamp. Install winamp. Install RR via the installer. Both of these are just next,next,next,finish type deals. After that RR Config pops up. I click the music path box, set to my music drive. Click the music types, select mp3. click save and exit. Double click RR icon on the desktop, and RoadRunner is playing the winamp llamma tune, everything works.

It comes with the default skin that works just fine. You never need to touch an ini file. Didnt need anything else.

so to reiterate:

what is so difficult about this!?!?

Well I found the problem and this is part of the problem with it not being intuative, it does come with a default skin but it doesn't know where it is and doesn't work untill you tell it where it is, I didn't know that the first time I tried it.

edit: I'm still sticking with my original opinion of it being to hard to setup, it's just to complicated and not intuative at all and things don't work how would expect them too, like setting the res, I set it at 800x480 configurer but it still renders at what looks like 800x600, I had to dig around in the ini files till I found something to fix that and then even getting it to reconize my music collection is pita, told the configurer were to find them and the broswer see them though nothing is in the proper track order desipite me telling it to use ID3 tags and when I click anything to play it it just goes back to the music player screen, doesn't play anything, other frontends for example are so much easier and intuative, like Frodoplayer, set folder location, click sync/build button and it's done and works.

From what I could see it does look nice and I do like the interface, but the setup is horible to the point of not worth it, what should be a simple task is extrodinarily cumbersome, hell it was easier to set up my music library in windows media player.

gummybear · 05-07-2008, 02:00 AM

i don't think thats the point some people are trying to make here, i know RR is free but i would've still expected after all this time that the installation is as painless as possible. esp if you want more people to use it, hence more reason for developers to do stuff on it.

it should just be ONE install file and thats it, no need for NOTHING ELSE.

you install it and the end it should ask you if you wish to run the program or setup now.

if you choose yet the setup process should be a painless few screens, just as an example:

1. general options (time, date, skin (should have default already), etc)
2. media options (audio location, video location, photo location, DVD)
3. GPS (if applicable)
4. Radio
5. Internet

settings like that, first two should be the main ones, others are like optional. i'm not trying to bag RR because i understand that it is a free program and people do invest alot of their OWN time and possibly money to develop for it.

but if RR fans are really passionate about the program then ease of use should be of key concern in regards to future development.

i've been using computers since i 11 years old, i do graphic design and use computers all day everyday and even i found RR hard to setup when i first started because it just aint a click and install type and you gotta spend a few good hours reading about the program and what files are needed to have it working properly, only then did i find RR an extremely great program to use.

Tidder · 05-09-2008, 12:11 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by 2k1Toaster

what is so difficult about this!?!?

We have computers in our cars. You would think that downloading 2 files, and running 2 installer packages wouldn't be too far out of reach.

C'mon Toast, I know you know that not everyone on this forum is a Techie. Hell, there are people on this forum that don't know how to manually install a driver. If it didn't come with Setup.exe they're screwed.

And on to point no. 2. Techies by their very nature are lazy.

I know I'd much rather have a handy dandy installer than trying to install by hand. I've recently made the full jump over to Ubuntu so I'm getting away from this train of thought, maybe if we all ran linux we wouldn't be so needy?

After compiling enough programs from source (dependancy issues, wrong version problems, packages missing), it sure is nice to just download a couple installers and watch everything just work.

Tidder · 05-09-2008, 12:15 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by gummybear

if you choose yet the setup process should be a painless few screens, just as an example:

1. general options (time, date, skin (should have default already), etc)
2. media options (audio location, video location, photo location, DVD)
3. GPS (if applicable)
4. Radio
5. Internet

settings like that, first two should be the main ones, others are like optional.

Therein lies the problem though. RR is a bad *** program... and with bad *** programs come bad *** options configuration.

Maybe if someone wrote an easier config proggy, with a bunch of Yes/No questions that ran right after install. Cause there still are options and stuff in my RR config I don't understand.

CarComp · 05-09-2008, 12:44 PM

*That sounds like something that has been done before... hmmmmm*

Hey whoever distributes RR, just include winamp. Its GPL or whatever that allows it to be redistributed freely (without profits), and RR uses an old version anyways right? Just include it, and have RR build the INI itself so you NEVER see it. Also why isn't RR defaulted to My Music for the playlists? Who is thinking about these things? Why aren't the GPS programs autodetected? its just a CLSID, or even an EXE file.

Furthermore, all INI files should re-create to their defaults if they are deleted. Thats a core feature of MediaEngine. Its really hard to mess up unless you start deleting skin files, and then it even still works because it has a built in super simple default skin. Placeholders really with black/white images.

I'd do this, but dang I don't really want to work on someone elses software. I'd rather work on my own.

RR isn't a badly written program. The code is actually VERY well structured and completely documented. Its just going in too many directions at once. Its like windows. Its quickly getting too big for a small group to manage. Its going to HAVE to have a custom website built to organize everything. MP3car forums just isn't going to cut it, and someone soon who is in charge or RR will realize this. I just hope they are a good website designer.

Maybe i'll do an installer some time. If you all like how M.E. installs, then let me know. I'll try to whip up an installer AND a config program with a walkthrough.