SD Navigation just does not work.

rumy · 02-25-2007, 11:30 PM

Hey guys,

So I finally went on a roadie after purchasing SD. It was all fun, but mappoint was a real disappointment.
It kept taking me wrong ways, for eg, when on the trans canada highway it would make me take some wierd local road exit and would guide me back onto the highway, it just does not make sense, why would it add those extra turns.

I dont know wheo to complain to. SD or msft, coz after using iguidance for years, I just dont think mappoint should be sold.

Again, StreetDecks trial does not include the nav part, and since it is very unreliable close to unusable what is SD doing about it?

Just wanted to share my horrible experience with my $200 piece of software... let me know if this is just something that happens in canada or every one is noticing it.

Thanks

parksgm · 02-26-2007, 12:07 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by rumy

when on the trans canada highway it would make me take some wierd local road exit and would guide me back onto the highway, it just does not make sense, why would it add those extra turns.

The speed settings for the various road types within SD make a difference in how it makes routes. Check out this thread.

Changing the speed limit values under the nav settings fixed the problem, for the most part. Try it and see what happens. :-)

Quote:

I dont know wheo to complain to. SD or msft, coz after using iguidance for years, I just dont think mappoint should be sold.

The developers are "aware" of the limitations of mappoint, as they mentioned in this thread (you started). I agree though, Mappoint seems to be inferior to Copilot, the other nav product I've tried. I may try running the two simultaneously to compare soon...

Quote:

Again, StreetDecks trial does not include the nav part

Good point. That makes it tough to evaluate a key portion of the program...although I guess it's the same situation with most Nav programs/software return policies...once you open the box, it's yours!

rumy · 02-26-2007, 12:17 AM

thaks for the tip... I will try and change the speeds and see if it works.

Hope SD does something about the nav prtion because other than that it is an amazing piece of work.

knyarko · 02-27-2007, 10:51 AM

What is the best GPS unit to use with SD. I have tried to get my Delorme GPS unit to work consistently but it just doesn't. I don't know if its an SD issue or the GPS issue, but often times SD tells me my GPS isn't connected. And the few times that it does find it, the GPS maps will freeze for about 10 - 15 seconds at a time.

DarquePervert · 02-27-2007, 12:53 PM

I don't think there's a best GPS receiver for StreetDeck. A receiver will either work well or not work well.

There is a thread about GPS receiver opinions in the FAQ Empurium. I suggest you check it out.

parksgm · 02-27-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by knyarko

What is the best GPS unit to use with SD. I have tried to get my Delorme GPS unit to work consistently but it just doesn't. I don't know if its an SD issue or the GPS issue, but often times SD tells me my GPS isn't connected. And the few times that it does find it, the GPS maps will freeze for about 10 - 15 seconds at a time.

Things I have found useful in getting the Delorme Earthmate USB GPS to work consistently:

Download and install the Delorme Earthmate Serial emulator from Delorme's website. Once installed, plug in your GPS, right click on the tray icon for the program and select "configure" to configure the program to send "NMEA" data to one of the listed ports (COM 2, 3, and 4 are listed in my version of the program).
Reboot
Right click on the tray icon again. This time, select "monitor". Then, click through the various tabs to find the tab that lists which satellites your GPS is receiving info from. Then, look under the "data" tab to ensure that your GPS is actively sending data. Finally, look under the "DOP" tab to see what sort of accuracy you can expect. "DOP" is "dilution of precision", and the more satellites your GPS has locked, the more precise it will be. Typical values for me are about 5M horizontal DOP and 5M vertical DOP.
Once you've verified that your GPS is locking on satellites, getting a "3D-Fix", and generating data through the Delome tray icon, reboot your computer several times and make sure that each time the computer boots, the GPS locks and you can verify data is being received by the GPS.
Open StreetDeck. Go to Settings --> Toggle Full Screen, and set SD to run windowed so that you can see what's going on. Then, go into the Nav settings and configure the SD Nav GPS port to match the port you specified in the Delorme tray icon in the first step. The "Autodetect" feature has never worked for me.
Reboot. Wait for the GPS to lock (LED on unit goes green). Check to see if the Delorme app is showing a locked GPS and data. Then, check to see if SD is receiving data. If not, make sure the port settings match once again, then reboot again. Wash, rinse, repeat. ;-)
Do NOT plug the Earthmate into different USB ports between reboots. Changing the USB port that the device is plugged into causes my computer to "lose" the GPS. Plugging it back into the same physical port it was configured on initially restores function after a reboot.

The GPS works every boot for me, as long as I don't change the USB port. However, the Earthmate still doesn't seem to be the most accurate GPS out there. I have the unit placed on my rear package shelf (1998 Mustang GT), and SD shows a bit of "uncertainty" as I drive...the place marker jumps very slightly (3-4 pixels) from side to side while driving down roads. At times, SD will think I'm on the access road for a main highway when I am in fact on a main highway lane. This correlates pretty well with the DOP error that I'm getting...5M is about 15-17 ft., which would be enough to place me in either lane of a main road or on the closest access road. I'm planning to move the GPS outside the car to see if that makes any difference.

Hope that helps.

knyarko · 02-27-2007, 10:30 PM

Thanks for the detailed reply parksgm. I'll try those steps and pray for success. I have performed some of those steps in the past, and sometimes SD finds the GPS Unit fine sometimes it doesn't. Most recently, whenever I restore the computer from Hibernation, SD can't find the GPS unit anymore. And when it did find it, I was a bit disappointed to find the map freezes every so often for sometimes about to 20 seconds (really bad when you are approaching a turn), and during this time I can see the GPS has a 3D fix because the status light is green. Anyway, after I play with this for a little while I might just go back to my TomTom 700. At least this experience has given me a new appreciation for a device thats always reliable.

parksgm · 02-27-2007, 11:17 PM

I experimented with moutning (well, taping, really) my Earthmate GPS unit to the top of my car in the "proper" location on a 100 mile trip today, and I monitored the number/signal strength of satellites that it found. I noticed a large improvement in accuracy and map scrolling smoothness compared to when I had previously placed the GPS unit on the package shelf in the rear window. I consistently had 7-8 satellites locked, and map scrolling was pretty smooth (when I glanced down anyway).

I'm going to try and find a better GPS unit to compare...or just figure out a way to waterproof the 'ole Earthmate.

I sympathize with your comment concerning returning to your TomTom...when I started my car computer project, the prices of even basic standalone GPS units were pretty high relative to features/screen size...but in the year or so it's taken me to assemble my unit piecemeal, prices have fallen while functionality has improved quite substantially. Such is the nature of tech...

StreetDeckAce · 03-02-2007, 09:40 PM

Map Point was not designed to be a in car navigation system. I used a tom tom before I worked with Streetdeck and I can say it wasn't always 100% perfect. (try to chat online with your tom tom in the wal-mart parking lot) We are looking into an upgrade to our navigation engine. Until then the small problems are just that, small. It is all I use. I just moved to Baltimore and for not knowing any part of town I'd say it gets me around just fine. This will take some time but we know this is an issue and want to find the best solution for everyone. I will keep every one up to date on the progress.

rumy · 03-03-2007, 08:54 PM

arrgghh this is driving me nutts. I paid almost 300 canadian $ for this software and the navigation tells me to go left when im supposed to go right. Why doesnt SD fix this.

Ohh and in the other thread they said they will charge a nominal fee for when they implement a new engine. how are they selling something that predominantly fails to serve its basic purpose of navigation!!!

when I talk to Streetdeck they say it is a msft product, but hey I bought a packaged solution and if there is such a big problem where it tells me to go left instead of right I think they should work with msft to fix it. Same with the problem I initially mentioned of recalculating the route.

I dont get it, they make such an amazing peice of software, have awesome customer support but then package this piece of art with microsoft **** that doesnt work. I shd sue some one for all the gas and time I lost on my roadtrip due to this bug or limitation or whatever the hell they call it.

Whoes having the same issue. come on people put in your input then we can get the ball rolling.

techy101 · 03-03-2007, 10:13 PM

No GPS will always route you the best way. After working with Delorme, SD, Mapmonkey/Freedrive (destinator) they all have the same issue. Just because it routes you a different way than you are used to doesn't mean that it won't get you there.

Plus, personally I only feel the need to be routed to places that I don't know how to get to.

About the Earthmates, get a BU-353. I went through 2 earthmates, and a Rikaline. The Rikaline was good, but it was only water resistant and met a watery grave. 90% of my gripes with GPS went away when I got rid of the Earthmate. Some people have had great luck with them, but through my time on here, I've read many more "My Earthmate isn't working..." threads than I can begin to count.

About things not being totally done... Carputers are still a young product in the commercial market. It's still a hobby at this point IMHO, and as such takes some work and patience. Up until not to long ago, I was using FrodoPlayer, Frodo SatRadioX, Freedrive, NaviVoice, and Delorme Street Atlas to have a working carputer. Most of the programs has many more bugs, took longer to get fixed, and often ended up dying. And most all of them required you to edit files and dig through long files to find the one line that you need to edit. (That's not anything against the coders who work so very very hard for us. Just that so many people wanted so many things it seemed like it became a full time job to keep moving the software along, and people (quite understandably) got burned out and dropped it)

At this point, any little bit of research will make it apparent that this hobby hasn't reached maturity yet, and that you can expect to have problems from the day you decide to get into it.

This is changing, and changing very quickly. SD is the first really all-inclusive commercial offering. And as such it's bound to have problems.

Also, this is fairly uncharted territory legally, and IIRC Microsoft has a patent on the "Car Computer" idea.

I just switched over, and after 3.5 years, and 9 carputer installs (two of my own), many many flip out/motorized screens I can say with certainty that this has bot to be the easiest, and most well functioning Front End/GPS/etc... that I've has the pleasure of setting up.

Bottom line is that if you're looking for the perfect plug-and-play solution, this probably isn't right for you. Give it a year or two and it probably will be, but not right now.

With that said, it's great to see more and more people get involved in our hobby. The more people we have in our community, the more force we can exert on the marketplace, and that means competition among vendors, and we all win in the end. We're getting more and more screens, PSU's, MoBo's, etc... as we speak. Just a few years ago there were a lot of people using Tank Circuit's and the UPS Serial shut down method as the startup/shutdown controller.

So come join, it's a great hobby with a great community, great people, and a wealth of knowledge. Just be ready to put some work into it too.

Mods: Sorry if this was out of line, just felt that it needed to be said.

rumy · 03-05-2007, 04:01 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by techy101

No GPS will always route you the best way. After working with Delorme, SD, Mapmonkey/Freedrive (destinator) they all have the same issue. Just because it routes you a different way than you are used to doesn't mean that it won't get you there.

nahh dude I gotta disagree, iGuidance, tom tom and CoPilot they work fantastic. Its not that mappoint is taking me a different route. at times it just takes you in circles.

No offense dude but from what I see in your profile you are not using SD so I dont think you quite understand what I mean. I was tolerant to the fact that mappoint (SD) would take me via a longer route, but when it says go left instead of right and takes you in circles for 1/2 hours its frustrating.

Quote:

Plus, personally I only feel the need to be routed to places that I don't know how to get to.

If I test it on a route I know only then will I know if it is a good GPS nav system or not.

I think us customers bi*ching about these systems will pressure developers to adopt better platforms and enhance development. specially for paid software.

Quote:

Bottom line is that if you're looking for the perfect plug-and-play solution, this probably isn't right for you. Give it a year or two and it probably will be, but not right now.

Im not looking for a plug and play solution, and kudos to SD for making such a great car pc frontend, but mappoint just does not work, hence people requested for the lite version without the nav software, guess I shd have known better. what im ****ed off about is ppl shd have mentioned the limitations on this forum so that us customers who were satisfied with the trial (which did not include the nav system) could be well informed that mappoint is just not ready.

techy101 · 03-05-2007, 04:02 PM

I haven't updated my profile, but I just made the switch to SD a bit ago.

upspace · 03-06-2007, 11:42 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by rumy

when it says go left instead of right

good to see that you had that too. the first time i have seen it, i had to stop the car because i went nutz... take a cigarette, lean back and to learn what is left and right again... well fortunately i have sd and it tells me but at the end i got confirme that my definition is still the correct one.

another fun experience with sd / mappoint.

sd wanted to take me once off the highway and to navigate me thru a forest with crappy (and even forbidden to drive) roads instead going straight another mile on the highway (which was already built before i was born so no card update issue here).

it is also fun when sd tells you to u-turn on highways... this is already worth the money to spend for sd - makes you laugh out loud.

any other fun stories about navigation with sd? would be a fun thread to read

rumy · 03-06-2007, 01:50 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by upspace

good to see that you had that too. the first time i have seen it, i had to stop the car because i went nutz... take a cigarette, lean back and to learn what is left and right again... well fortunately i have sd and it tells me but at the end i got confirme that my definition is still the correct one.

another fun experience with sd / mappoint.

sd wanted to take me once off the highway and to navigate me thru a forest with crappy (and even forbidden to drive) roads instead going straight another mile on the highway (which was already built before i was born so no card update issue here).

it is also fun when sd tells you to u-turn on highways... this is already worth the money to spend for sd - makes you laugh out loud.

any other fun stories about navigation with sd? would be a fun thread to read

hahahaha I know what you mean..... maybe some one should start a thread called SD/mappoint Bloopers or rename this one... lol.... seems like SD has given up on us in regards to mappoint.

Another funny one is when SD tells you to take a left in a no entry and on the screen it says left turn is prohibited....

and another one is when it tells you to keep straight on a highway which has not had or doesnt have an exit for miles.