Production Double-Din VGA Touchscreen in the making! - Page 3

Mrbmw99 · 01-30-2007, 01:51 AM

No it wasn't already designed. The biggest thing was sourcing the LCD screen since the whole design replies on that specific model.

Think about it. Prototype PCB's take 2 weeks or so, and a production run of PCBs and enclosure takes roughly 4 weeks (depending). We have between 10 and 18 weeks to stay on target (April/May). We can do it!

Like I said, we're both working very hard on piecing this whole thing together and making it work. We've needed a product like this on the market for a long time now!

Kinda early to give a final price, but I estimate Version 1 & 2 ~ $725.00, and Version 3 @ ~ 1,399.00. Please don't quote me on this. They may be even cheaper than the DL065A's, or a bit higher than this. Again it's still too early to tell.

- Brett

PS: I forgot to mention: I believe the firmware on the controller will be USB upgradeable, so new features can be added later.

2k1Toaster · 01-30-2007, 01:53 AM

If you want to give any away for beta testers, let me know!

I'll definately be keeping an eye on this.

gospeed.racer · 01-30-2007, 02:06 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

However, I have since found different sources to get the 6.5" LCD's from. This means we will be using the SHARP 6.5" WVGA 800x480 LCD's in our design.

I think you made a great choice. A few years ago I would have said go for the 7", most people woudnt mind because back then the people doing this in car computer stuff were serious about it and didnt mind fabricating. Its not a hobby now. Today you need to make everything so simple your grandma could operate it, and anyone that can read instructions can install it. You arent dealing with just hobbyists anymore.

Jasin · 01-30-2007, 08:01 AM

I did not see anything mentioning a dvd drive, I take it, it is assumed but I just want to make sure.

06BlueZ · 01-30-2007, 02:39 PM

Also, what about adding some RCA preamp audio outs (front, rear, sub)? Maybe even do away with the internal amp... That is one of hte reasons I didn't get the digitalww one.

Mrbmw99 · 01-30-2007, 08:34 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Jasin

I did not see anything mentioning a dvd drive, I take it, it is assumed but I just want to make sure.

Yes, there will be a CD/DVD drive inside the unit.

Quote: Originally Posted by 06BlueZ

Also, what about adding some RCA preamp audio outs (front, rear, sub)? Maybe even do away with the internal amp... That is one of hte reasons I didn't get the digitalww one.

Post #26, this thread:

Quote:

(1) Set of 4 (LF, RF, LR, RR) 3v RMS Pre-Outs for external Amplifier

- Brett

kirby260 · 01-31-2007, 12:31 AM

I know I would like small things like:

having the ability to set primary input (on power on) through a jumper or the like.

The ability to have a customisable 'spash screen' with a delay before switching to primary input. (this would likley be a function of the LCD controller itself, but with my experience with LCD's it can be changed)

FMode · 01-31-2007, 03:26 AM

huge hug for BMW99

I believe these "TFT-manufacturers in the east" will never get it done right... it must be done by the community...

so here is the way to go:

Do you need help with the Firmware (the dead reckoning algorithm is somewhat tricky I think) ? Go Open Source and we (the car pc community) will kick *** (and implement dead reckoning later).

...as Amplifier you can take a TDA 7560 (?) - for Radio you can buy something from XTronic ?

.... and lets collect for Bill Gates he will not be the richest man on the world if this Indash Unit is done !

FMode · 01-31-2007, 05:24 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

...
Tenative Info:
Version 1: (Basic Video-Only HU)
(1) External VGA Input
(3) External Composite Video Inputs
(1) B-Style USB Connector (for connecting to the external PC)
(2-4) A-Style USB Connectors (for connecting external gear like GPS to the HU)

Version 2: (Basic HU with Internal Audio Support)
(1) External VGA Input
(3) External Composite Video Inputs
(3) External Audio Line-Inputs (Paired with the Video Inputs)
(1) Set of 4 (LF, RF, LR, RR) 3v RMS Pre-Outs for external Amplifier
(1) 4x45w Amplifier (LF, RF, LR, RR) Speaker Outputs
(1) Digital Audio Input RCA (SPDIF?)
(1) Digital Audio Output RCA (SPDIF?)
(1) B-Style USB Connector (for connecting to the external PC)
(2-4) A-Style USB Connectors (for connecting external gear like GPS to the HU)

Version 3: (Full Blown Internal CarPC System, with external A/V inputs)
(2-3) External Composite Video Inputs
(2-3) External Audio Line-Inputs (Paired with the Video Inputs)
(1) Set of 4 (LF, RF, LR, RR) 3v RMS Pre-Outs for external Amplifier
(1) 4x45w Amplifier (LF, RF, LR, RR) Speaker Outputs
(1) Digital Audio Input RCA (SPDIF?)
(1) Digital Audio Output RCA (SPDIF?)
(4-6) A-Style USB Connectors (for connecting external gear like GPS to the HU)
(1) Internal Nano-ITX PC System
(1) RCA Video Output (connects to Nano-ITX Mobo)

Version 2: Please add a Radio with RDS (!!!!) and a simple USB Audio Controller for 5 Euros (saves audio lines running through the car from the trunk-pc)
(I think a Diversity TV Tuner WITH USB video grabber (!!!) is too expensive

)
This USB Audio controller is for the non-car-pc people (the masses) without amplifier in the trunk.

Does a removable GPS board make any sense ? Who of us is not doing navigation with its car pc ? So we all need GPS...
...and a GPS without Deadreckoning doesn't make its really more expensive but makes your unit VERY professional so that it can easily compete with Alpines and Blaupunkts and stuff.

For Version 3 you got my full respect if you got this to fly ! I think this will be VERY difficult to fit a Nano-ITX inside (if I look into my CID650)

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

Like I said, we're both working very hard on piecing this whole thing together and making it work. We've needed a product like this on the market for a long time now!

I am waiting 7 years now for such a product...

Mrbmw99 · 01-31-2007, 02:02 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by FMode

Do you need help with the Firmware (the dead reckoning algorithm is somewhat tricky I think) ? Go Open Source and we (the car pc community) will kick *** (and implement dead reckoning later).

...as Amplifier you can take a TDA 7560 (?) - for Radio you can buy something from XTronic ?
Thanks for the diagram - it's actually pretty close to what will be done. I haven't looking into the TDA 7560 yet, but I will. I think we will be using the Microtune AM/FM/RDS modules (IF they ever return my calls!).

.... and lets collect for Bill Gates he will not be the richest man on the world if this Indash Unit is done !

Boy - that'd be nice!

Quote: Originally Posted by FMode

Version 2: Please add a Radio with RDS (!!!!) and a simple USB Audio Controller for 5 Euros (saves audio lines running through the car from the trunk-pc)
(I think a Diversity TV Tuner WITH USB video grabber (!!!) is too expensive

)
This USB Audio controller is for the non-car-pc people (the masses) without amplifier in the trunk.
I am looking into using USB audio chips. This would be my preferred way of doing this because it would allow the frontend to "fade" or switch between audio sources nice and cleanly.

Does a removable GPS board make any sense ? Who of us is not doing navigation with its car pc ? So we all need GPS...
...and a GPS without Deadreckoning doesn't make its really more expensive but makes your unit VERY professional so that it can easily compete with Alpines and Blaupunkts and stuff.
The GPS will be a module that we can install. It's not our design. So, it's easy for someone to say yes they want it or no they do not. Either way, the mainboard will have the circuitry to interface to it regardless of whether or not the module is actually install (meaning it can even be added later). I don't know much about dead reckoning, maybe you can send me some good documentation?

For Version 3 you got my full respect if you got this to fly ! I think this will be VERY difficult to fit a Nano-ITX inside (if I look into my CID650)
It will be tight in there, but I'm sure it will work ok. In the CID650/DL065A, it wasn't really meant for an internal board. The DVD drive is mounted low, there are a lot of tall components on the mainboard, right in the center, etc etc... Plus, a Nano-ITX is only 4.7"x4.7" wide. Then I have to do the HDD, PS, Heat-Dissipation, etc, but it should all work. Great thing is - we will have an answer from the CAD software before we even start building anything!

I am waiting 7 years now for such a product...

So can we consider you a customer now?
- Brett

Jasin · 01-31-2007, 02:42 PM

i see only outputs for speakers, is their a way to convert the pre outs for subs or is there really a diffrence?

also as the unit will not be motorized where would the dvd drive sit as if its the same size as the DD it doesn't look like there would be a lot of room?

and I prob will buy one of these are it is looking exactly what I want.

do you know the specs on the computer you plan to put in there?

hammer32 · 01-31-2007, 08:27 PM

Excellent! I like the idea of different models and the pre-amp outs, I'll be installing one in a 2007 FJ Cruiser and hooking it up to a Mac Mini. Will the programmable buttons be available to Mac OS X?

Mrbmw99 · 02-01-2007, 12:46 AM

I hope so! I have ZERO Mac and Linux programming skills. However, the USB device will be recognized as a Human Interface Device (HID) in Windows, which the drivers already exist for. No additional drivers will be necessary. I do not know how this works on a Mac. I'd like to get together with someone who know's Mac's from technical/programming standpoint and discuss this. Linux too...

- Brett

FMode · 02-01-2007, 02:53 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

So can we consider you a customer now?
- Brett

Sure !

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

Thanks for the diagram - it's actually pretty close to what will be done. I haven't looking into the TDA 7560 yet, but I will. I think we will be using the Microtune AM/FM/RDS modules (IF they ever return my calls!).

Nonono

Uh Uh Uh, You didn't say the magic word !

! don't waste time (concentrate on UNSOLVED problems! don't reinvent the wheel) - the XTronic guys have solved this problem already - contact them (they can supply you with IC's, ...) - what about installing a HQCT onboard ? (everyone needs a radio and its cheaper to design it onboard) (removing their PIC still saves money)

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

.... and lets collect for Bill Gates he will not be the richest man on the world if this Indash Unit is done !
Boy - that'd be nice!

Did you ever install a PC into a Car ? think about the problems and try to solve them with your Unit ! (this is the secret)
Remember: a carinfotainment-system with DVD and Navigation costs around 2500 Euro/$ - if your system with a PC (Voom+M2ATX+MiniITX) costs the same and has the same features (plus the versatility of the PC) then you have a killer-prooduct.

Such carinfotainment-systems have a daylight sensor (thats only a "cent part") so if the headlights are on they turn on their night skin - if its bright now in the car (lamps beside the streets) they raise their background illimunation.
DON'T do this logic yourself (THIS has to be done in the frontends!).

Some of these I/O lines are also a good idea to consider:
If the ON button on your unit is pressed you can switch on the PC...
or if the doors are opened/or the central lock is switched... (this is a firmware issue - see my statement about open source) then the PC could start with switched off TFT...

Illumination of Buttons:
Measure the Voltage of the Indash_Illumination/Headlights_on_signal to be able to control their brightness (also done in "professional" systems).
Have you ever see blue illumination in a BMW ? Looks like aftermarket and not factory install (and "battles" with the orange dash illum.). So use RGB LED's (they are some cents more expensive) than green, orange, blue or red LED's.

You see: some parts are only cents but raises the unit from cheap aftermarket crap to professional level.

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

I am looking into using USB audio chips. This would be my preferred way of doing this because it would allow the frontend to "fade" or switch between audio sources nice and cleanly.

these things are really nice...

Quote: Originally Posted by Mrbmw99

The GPS will be a module that we can install. It's not our design. So, it's easy for someone to say yes they want it or no they do not. Either way, the mainboard will have the circuitry to interface to it regardless of whether or not the module is actually install (meaning it can even be added later). I don't know much about dead reckoning, maybe you can send me some good documentation?

Sorry there is none available ... but if the Satellites=0 then look for the Gyro and the speed pulse and continue to write the NMEA stream yourself...
The U-Blox module + Gyro is expensive if your order only one - but I could imagine if your order masses of them their price may fall significantly...
(search for U-Blox in this forum for more info) www.u-blox.com

Don't care for the software - concentrate on hardware... What about open source ? You feel that it could be copied easily ?
Sorry guy I could copy it without your open source software too - I only need some money...

DarquePervert · 02-01-2007, 06:21 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by FMode

everyone needs a radio

We do?